R-pod Owners Forum Homepage

This site is free to use.
Donations benefit a non-profit Girls Softball organization

Forum Home Forum Home > R-pod Discussion Forums > I need HELP!!!
  New Posts New Posts RSS Feed: 50 or 30 amp
  FAQ FAQ  Forum Search   Calendar   Register Register  Login Login

Topic Closed50 or 30 amp
 Post Reply Post Reply Page  <1 56789 14>
Author
Message
  Share Topic Share Topic  Topic Search Topic Search  Topic Options Topic Options
Motor7 View Drop Down
Senior Member
Senior Member


Joined: 09 Jan 2019
Location: E. TN
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 196 		Direct Link To This Post Topic: 50 or 30 amp
    Posted: 30 Jan 2019 at 12:34pm
I had to take out my 2011 Arc Fault breakers that code made me installed when I built the place. Even the electrical inspector told me they would start falsely tripping after a year or so. He was right, so now I have two $40 paperweights. 
2016 R-Pod 176T
Back to Top
GlueGuy View Drop Down
Senior Member
Senior Member
Avatar

Joined: 15 May 2017
Location: N. California
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 2634 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 Jan 2019 at 12:40pm
Originally posted by offgrid

BTW are you sure about the early 90s date? AFCIs weren’t in the code till the 1999 cycle which most jurisdictions adopted in 2002 so I don’t think they were available yet in the early 90s. Mine was one of the first houses in my area to get them.
No I am not sure, as they are all gone now, and we replaced them shortly after moving in in 1996. All I know is that when we turned on, or turned off lights that were on one of those circuits, we would get a false trip, and have to go over to the panel and reset one of them. If we were running an iron or some other mid-to-moderate load and unplugged without turning the device off, the small arc at the plug would trip them. So maybe they weren't AFCI, but they were sure acting like AFCI.
bp
2017 R-Pod 179 Hood River
2015 Ford F150 SuperCrew 4WD 3.5L Ecoboost
Back to Top
mcarter View Drop Down
podders Helping podders - pHp
podders Helping podders - pHp
Avatar

Joined: 07 Apr 2016
Location: Greenbrier, TN
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 3419 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 Jan 2019 at 2:12pm
Well team, I'm still going to use my 50A to 30A dogbone, and to me it is not a risk decision. There's nothing that indicates a fire risk, granted you can have HOT risk from bad cables, that cable is bad on a 30A CB too. I also think the Pod 30A CB sees any power applied "upstream" like the Micro and AC. Probably still travel with propane ON.
Mike Carter
2015 178
" I had the right to remain silent, I just didn't have the ability."
Back to Top
offgrid View Drop Down
Senior Member
Senior Member


Joined: 23 Jul 2018
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 5290 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: 31 Jan 2019 at 7:13am
By upstream I mean toward the direction from which power is flowing, eg, the pedestal, downstream I mean toward the loads. 

The 30A CB in the pod has no way to know if there is a fault upstream from it. It only knows about load and fault currents flowing through it heading downstream. If the fault is in the cable or in the trailer connector or in the conductors between the trailer connector and the pod breaker panel then the conductors from the pedestal to the fault will see the total of the fault current plus the load currents of anything you have on in the trailer. The trailer cb will see the load currents only. If the load currents are 30A or less and the combined fault and load currents exceed 30A but are less than 50A then neither the park's 50A nor the pod's 30A breaker will trip, but the 30A rated conductors up to the fault location will overheat. That is where the fire risk lies.

That being said mcarter, I have no issues with your decision to continue to use your 50 to 30A dogbone (or to leave your propane cylinder on).

Peace. 
1994 Chinook Concourse
1995 RV6A Experimental Aircraft
2015 Rpod 179 - sold
Back to Top
crankster78 View Drop Down
Senior Member
Senior Member


Joined: 08 May 2018
Location: Minn
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 163 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: 31 Jan 2019 at 7:57am
Greetings 
The pods have a 110 volt breaker on the panel in the pod which Is I believe a 30 amp.  So the main concern is the 10 gauge cable to the station.  The surge protectors are a very good idea.  Many campgrounds have old systems and of course a nearby lightning strike or high winds could cause problems

Crankster78
Crankster 78 R-179 2015
Back to Top
offgrid View Drop Down
Senior Member
Senior Member


Joined: 23 Jul 2018
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 5290 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: 31 Jan 2019 at 8:10am
The 10 AWG cable to the pedestal yes but also the 10 AWG conductors between the connector on the pod and the 30A cb. In my 179 that is about a 10 ft run inside the floor and walls. That part of the circuit would worry me personally the most because its in contact with flammable materials inside the trailer.  Also the trailer connector itself isn't rated for 50A.

Surge protectors are a good idea and offer protection from lightning strikes but won't help for the kind of overcurrent fault we're discussing here. 

On the question of whether the arc fault breakers are better now, I'm not sure but it looks like we're on the 3rd or 4th generation already. The original type from 1999 aren't even allowed anymore. The newer ones are intended to detect series arcs (like from a loose connection) as well as the kind of parallel line to line and line to ground arcs we've been discussing. So they are still adding features and sorting the technology out. 
1994 Chinook Concourse
1995 RV6A Experimental Aircraft
2015 Rpod 179 - sold
Back to Top
mcarter View Drop Down
podders Helping podders - pHp
podders Helping podders - pHp
Avatar

Joined: 07 Apr 2016
Location: Greenbrier, TN
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 3419 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: 31 Jan 2019 at 8:55am
Offgrid,

+1. Absolutely agree with this statement from your post:

"If the load currents are 30A or less and the combined fault and load currents exceed 30A but are less than 50A then neither the park's 50A nor the pod's 30A breaker will trip, but the 30A rated conductors up to the fault location will overheat. That is where the fire risk lies."

That is spot on to where a fire risk exists.
Mike Carter
2015 178
" I had the right to remain silent, I just didn't have the ability."
Back to Top
offgrid View Drop Down
Senior Member
Senior Member


Joined: 23 Jul 2018
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 5290 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: 31 Jan 2019 at 9:06am
10-4. 

Looks like we're in "violent agreement" at this point mcarter Thumbs Up
1994 Chinook Concourse
1995 RV6A Experimental Aircraft
2015 Rpod 179 - sold
Back to Top
GlueGuy View Drop Down
Senior Member
Senior Member
Avatar

Joined: 15 May 2017
Location: N. California
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 2634 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: 31 Jan 2019 at 9:22am
Originally posted by offgrid

10-4. 

Looks like we're in "violent agreement" at this point mcarter Thumbs Up 
Let's not get violent! I can't imagine the number of electrons that might be harmed!
bp
2017 R-Pod 179 Hood River
2015 Ford F150 SuperCrew 4WD 3.5L Ecoboost
Back to Top
TheBum View Drop Down
Senior Member
Senior Member


Joined: 26 Feb 2016
Location: Texas
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 1407 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: 31 Jan 2019 at 10:35am
I'm tempted to design a 50A-to-30A adapter with a built-in 30A breaker. That would solve the fire hazard issue with the wiring between the pedestal and the main breaker in the Pod.
Alan
2022 R-Pod 196 "RaptoRPod"
2022 Ram 1500 Lone Star 4x4
Three cats
Back to Top
 Post Reply Post Reply Page  <1 56789 14>

Forum Jump Forum Permissions View Drop Down

Bulletin Board Software by Web Wiz Forums® version 9.64
Copyright ©2001-2009 Web Wiz