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Have You Done Any Mods?
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Poll Question: Have you done any mods to your R-Pod?
Poll Choice Votes Poll Statistics
683 [81.41%]
10 [1.19%]
134 [15.97%]
10 [1.19%]
2 [0.24%]
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Linda&Gino View Drop Down
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Posts: 32 		Post Options Post Options   Quote Linda&Gino Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: Have You Done Any Mods?
    Posted: 28 Jan 2023 at 12:35pm
Hi Marv. When I started researching replacement tires for our 179 a year ago, I wanted to stay with the same tire profile that was stock. We were a month from leaving in a ~4K mile trip and I didn't want to change what worked well for us in the past. After consulting with two independent tires shops that performed tires services for the majority of the RV dealers in Albuquerque, plus speaking directly with Forest River, I decided to go with the recommendation of all three, which was a 10 ply LT tire inflated to 65psi, which would give a higher load capacity than the stock Westlakes. Forest River uses LT tires on their Wolf Pup series as do other manufacturers including Airstream.

There's a lot of info out there so folks need to make their own informed decisions. The point is moot for me as my new trailer is a tandem axle with a common ST tire size. That said, I will stay with ST tires on this rig.
gpokluda
2017 Rpod R179 SOLD!
2022 Escape 5.0 TA
2022 Ford F150 4X4 EB3.5
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lostagain View Drop Down
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Posts: 2587 		Post Options Post Options   Quote lostagain Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 Jan 2023 at 12:40pm
+1 to Marvin's comment.
Never leave footprints behind.
Fred & Maria Kearney
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Marvin View Drop Down
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Posts: 45 		Post Options Post Options   Quote Marvin Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 Jan 2023 at 1:25pm
Hi Linda& Gino,

With dual axils you at least have a extra safety feature.

Interesting what you heard.  I can only tell what I heard from tow truck operators and the major Tire Repair in Indianapolis.

What I failed to mention was it took me 3 tow/tire repair trucks before I found one that would change the different model/rating tire at 9pm on a Saturday.  I was a Liability issue on their part if they changed it.   Each told me horror stories of what they have seen including the Tire place that that I finally found, as well as 2 RV dealers that we stop at during our 7,000 mile trip.  The tire dealer explained in detail why it was a bad idea and he spoke from experience... especially when he found out I was at cruising speed on major interstates and high Mt passes with no guard rails.   

You bring up a good point about what manufacture's recommend.   If they recommend it then it might be ok for that model. 
Marv

2019 RP178 Highly Modified
2022 Subaru Outback Wilderness Turbo Charger
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Linda&Gino View Drop Down
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Posts: 32 		Post Options Post Options   Quote Linda&Gino Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 Jan 2023 at 2:23pm
Marv, no doubt there's a lot of conflicting information and opinions out there. Truth be told, if there had been a viable ST alternative besides the Westlakes, I would have gone that route. Never the less, the Flaken Wildpeaks performed just fine. They had about 5K miles on them when we sold the Rpod. In those miles, the 179 tracked true, never wallowed or showed any signs of instability or abnormal wear. I dutifully informed the buyer that it had LT tires and what the recommended inflation was since it was different than the stockers.
gpokluda
2017 Rpod R179 SOLD!
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lostagain View Drop Down
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Posts: 2587 		Post Options Post Options   Quote lostagain Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 Jan 2023 at 3:11pm
It would not be surprising to learn that travel trailer dealers and manufacturers decisions regarding the use of the LT off road tires are being made by marketing people who are trying to create an impression on the part of their customers that the trailers can go anywhere because of the gnarly tires.  On the other hand, if you were to contact tire engineers at tire manufacturing companies you'd probably find out that they would not recommend P or LT tires, no matter what the tread design, because of the less stiff side walls as compared to the ST [Special Trailer] tires.  

If you really feel the need for and/or will be driving in snowy conditions with your trailer, there are ST tires available with snow tread.  eTrailer has some, but they're pretty pricey, [https://www.etrailer.com/Trailer-Tires-and-Wheels/Westlake/WST34FR.html]. For most of us, we don't do much snow camping and in the off chance one must occasionally travel in snowy conditions requiring the extra traction, chains may be an easier and less costly alternative.  Also keep in mind that some states require trailer tires to be chained up when there are chain controls in effect for other vehicles, even for 4x4's with snow tires.  Best to check the rules where you anticipate snow driving before leaving.  For example, https://dot.ca.gov/-/media/dot-media/documents/chainrequire-a11y.pd.  Personally, if I had to confront driving in the snow with treacherous conditions or chain controls in effect, unless I was trying to run from the sheriff, I'd just wait until the weather improved and/ or the chain controls were taken down.  
Never leave footprints behind.
Fred & Maria Kearney
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Our Pod 172
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Marvin View Drop Down
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Posts: 45 		Post Options Post Options   Quote Marvin Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 Jan 2023 at 3:21pm
Gpokluda, Great post.  So true... the ST's are very hard to find in stock.

Here is something I find very interesting... maybe you can explain it.
After I got the LT's I was very nervous about the 80PSI in them because we had previously hit a lot of road construction and then there were the concrete slab interstates. The LT's with 45lbs (Dealer recomended) that trailer bounced on every one of the slab cracks and I had to do about 10mph or less under the speed limit.   Once I got the ST's with 80PSI the bouncing stopped and I easily did the legal speed no problem.  Mater of fact... I had to use the cruse because the ride was so good I would get carried away with a heavy foot.  Maybe the LT's off road were a stiffer tire I don't know, but changing to the ST's was well worth it to us, and may have saved our life in a close call.    
Marv

2019 RP178 Highly Modified
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Marvin View Drop Down
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Posts: 45 		Post Options Post Options   Quote Marvin Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 Jan 2023 at 3:33pm
Hi Lost again... Humm... Love that name but I never get lost because I'm always exploring... or so I tell People. :-) 

I found out that its not illegal for a dealer to put any tire he wants on a trailer even if its not recomended.  I think in my case they put it on to make the used 178 trailer more attractive.
Marv

2019 RP178 Highly Modified
2022 Subaru Outback Wilderness Turbo Charger
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Linda&Gino View Drop Down
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Posts: 32 		Post Options Post Options   Quote Linda&Gino Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 Jan 2023 at 4:12pm
@Marv, Forest River recommended 65psi in the LT tires. They strongly discouraged 80psi because the wheels on the Rpod are not rated at that pressure. Furthermore, when we had the tires installed at one of the tire shops that serviced RV dealers, they would not install an 80psi tire valve for the same reason. The standard tire valve found on most passenger cars, pickups and travel trailer is rated at 65psi max. 

@LA, ask an engineer anything and you will usually get a lot of explanation but nothing definitive. I know because I work with engineers everyday and I, myself, am a recovering engineer. LOL FWIW, I don't think any of us plan to travel in bad weather, but sometimes it happens. 
gpokluda
2017 Rpod R179 SOLD!
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Posts: 45 		Post Options Post Options   Quote Marvin Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 Jan 2023 at 4:36pm
So let me see if i get this straight... your an engineer and your telling me this.  Ok.. I bit.

Thanks for the information.  65 it is.
Marv

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Posts: 2587 		Post Options Post Options   Quote lostagain Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 Jan 2023 at 5:49pm
If you use load range D ST tires the max pressure is 65 lbs.  If you use higher load range, there is no requirement that you max out on the pressure as long as you have enough air in the tire to have the tread pressing evenly on the pavement and the side walls adequately supported.  

Marv' it's not an issue of being "legal" or "illegal," but rather an issue of making your self legally liable if something goes wrong.  You can put any tire on a trailer that you like, but if you have an accident, someone like me -- before I retired -- would end up defending you at the request of your insurance company for negligence and the company would probably pay a lot of money in your behalf, only to squeeze it out of you later as your loss history would be a lot worse.  If it was incredibly gross negligence, then there could be liability for criminal negligence but you'd need a different kind of lawyer than the kind of practice I had.

gpokluda, there are all kinds of engineers just like there are all kinds of other professionals.  I wouldn't have my gastroenterologist do a heart valve replacement on me and have high expectations of a successful surgery. ... and I probably wouldn't like the approach to my heart s/he might attempt.  I used to defend tire companies and worked with some very capable engineers whose specialty involved tire design.  Those are the kind of engineers I'm talking about.  A software engineer or electronic engineer may not really fit the bill.  I doubt any real tire engineer would recommend using LT or P tires on a trailer carrying the weight of the typical travel trailer, even the light weight ones.

As for dealers and travel trailer companies putting on LT tires for show, the'll need a pretty good lawyer to wiggle out of the law suit when the tire engineer says the tire makes the trailer defective and the rules of product liability are applied.  If one sells a defective product and someone gets hurt, there is strict liability.  The difficulty for the plaintiff's attorney is proving the defect, as opposed to driving 90 with a trailer on a bumpy road, was the cause of the crash.  If I were a corporate lawyer for FR or another trailer company, which thankfully I'm not, I'd caution against putting LT tires on trailers.  If they want the gnarly look, get some of the Westlakes I linked to above, and charge $500 more for the trailer.

And
Never leave footprints behind.
Fred & Maria Kearney
Sonoma 167RB
Our Pod 172
2019 Ford F-150 4x4 2.7 EcoBoost
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