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Topic ClosedFloor failure!!!

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GlueGuy View Drop Down
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Direct Link To This Post Topic: Floor failure!!!
    Posted: 13 Oct 2019 at 10:18am
I'm going to speculate that your floor did not "sag" in the first place, but rather that the frame bowed upward in the middle.  The box of the trailer is pretty well fastened to the floor, so the floor itself was still mostly straight. When they straightened the frame, the floor just conformed to the original shape.
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Olddawgsrule View Drop Down
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13 Oct 2019 at 4:18pm
Originally posted by GlueGuy

I'm going to speculate that your floor did not "sag" in the first place, but rather that the frame bowed upward in the middle.  The box of the trailer is pretty well fastened to the floor, so the floor itself was still mostly straight. When they straightened the frame, the floor just conformed to the original shape.

Okay, can go with this to a point and be comfortable about it.

The bottom line comes down to the amount of flex that occurred and what is left now that it returned.

The floor is nothing more than a SIP. Laminated whatever's over foam. If you've ever laminated or veneered you'd know there is a extreme you can not pass of flex before something cracks. I do believe my sag has gone far beyond that point.

I see my dealer as seeing the same and not giving me my trailer back quickly as proof of such. They also want to see what delimitation has happened. 

It's not just a "It returned to shape" thing. It's more of what happened and how to deal with. 

I see outriggers to hold, yet I see injecting glues to regain the lamination. 

What glues? How much? Procedure? I have clues to how, yet no experience in doing so. That is about to come I figure.

Woud I just stand with "It came be back to shape?" NO! 
I want it to stay there.

With a tag of GlueGuy... Tell me the glue I should be injecting.
   
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GlueGuy View Drop Down
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 14 Oct 2019 at 9:29am
I do have a fair amount of experience with composites and glue. My "Glue Guy" nickname was somewhat metaphorical some 30 years ago, but not without cause. 

I'm sure you've had some delamination in the floor, but have no idea how much or how extensive. I also don't know what the materials are (or were). I know from having drilled a hole or two through our floor that there is some plywood and some foam. The problem is that some foams are susceptible to some glues, so you would probably want to consult with Forest River about glues might be injected there. 

My general thoughts would be to support the floor where it looks like it needs help; drill a couple of holes; then inject the appropriate adhesive. Wait for the cure, then remove the supports.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 14 Oct 2019 at 1:04pm
Originally posted by GlueGuy

I do have a fair amount of experience with composites and glue. My "Glue Guy" nickname was somewhat metaphorical some 30 years ago, but not without cause. 

I'm sure you've had some delamination in the floor, but have no idea how much or how extensive. I also don't know what the materials are (or were). I know from having drilled a hole or two through our floor that there is some plywood and some foam. The problem is that some foams are susceptible to some glues, so you would probably want to consult with Forest River about glues might be injected there. 

My general thoughts would be to support the floor where it looks like it needs help; drill a couple of holes; then inject the appropriate adhesive. Wait for the cure, then remove the supports.

I'll dig deeper once it's back home. My dealer is already checking with FR of possible remedies. Once here I will invest age further to learn materials involved and reach out to my builder group as well for their thoughts. They are building with foam and laminating several different materials with success. Even some are fiberglassing and that sounds most interesting to me to inject. 

P.S. I was teasing as well as asking when I mentioned your handle. Happy to see you took it as intended.

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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 Oct 2019 at 2:14pm
Lily is home now! She will go back again at some point according to results of questions/issues asked. Yet for now she is home can be be late-season used.

I'll think about how I want to start another thread on what I have learned and how I will set her back up. Right now, I do not see the WDH going back on. With only 1/4" difference in wheel well height, I'm no longer seeing the need. I think, as many do, I jumped to quick not understanding a WDH. Thanks to you folks I now do.

I can not say enough about my Dealership and the efforts put forward on my behalf. Cold Springs RV has been a blessing! 






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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 Oct 2019 at 2:37pm
Now, I did finally run the program Offgrid offered. It's a bit complex, yet entering what you can gives you an idea of what is happening. Obviously, the better the numbers, the better the result of true effect.

I wish to thank him once again for presenting to us and hope others use it as well.

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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 Nov 2019 at 2:24pm
Back to the Dealership again today. Now we're working with the deflected tongue frame.

This would be 4 weeks into it being submitted, they asked for specific pictures. 'Everything' we shot today, we did before, but now it's by their request.. We 'again' confirmed a 3/4" upward pitch in the tongue frame. This is from the weld at the trailer cabin to the ball coupling mount. 

By the time sequence of the Cabin frame issue, I figure Mid-January I'll be asked to bring the trailer in.. 

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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 Nov 2019 at 4:52pm
what is up with FR, every time I see a post its usually something that's failing on the Pods.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 Nov 2019 at 9:18am
Originally posted by Olddawgsrule

Now, I did finally run the program Offgrid offered. It's a bit complex, yet entering what you can gives you an idea of what is happening. Obviously, the better the numbers, the better the result of true effect.

I wish to thank him once again for presenting to us and hope others use it as well.


Thank you. 

When you ran the calculator, what did you wind up with as front axle load with the trailer attached and no wdh compared to the front load without the trailer?  

My concern from a couple of reports I've seen would be that the Taco apparently has a pretty stiff front suspension which is not showing much change in ride height when you load the trailer on the hitch. If that is the case its going to be difficult to use front ride height to know how much load you have there, but that doesn't necessarily mean you wouldn't be better off using a wdh if the front end is getting light without it. 

Remember that its the front of your TV that is controlling turning as well as a large part of your braking action, and if its getting light there the tire contact patch can't do its job controlling the rig. Regardless of what the ride height is, for safety you really want the front axle loading while towing to be pretty much the same as it is when not towing.  The calculator will tell you what that loading is if you have it set up right and/or you can run through a scale to get it. 

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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 Feb 2020 at 11:04am
Latest update: Lippert sent the Tech to my home to inspect the tongue frame. Good hour spent with him going over it. Basically it's not bent, it's tilted up.

He began to explain to me that it's done on purpose, but as I rolled my eyes and said "You're not really believing I'm falling for that!" He stopped and we went into it a bit further.

He explained that the tongue beam is pasted through the cross beam making it a solid beam from ball hitch to side frame beam. Good news if true.. I really can not yet confirm, just to much snow/ice to lay down there and get some good dimensions. Believe the tongue beam would be about 1/8-3/16 smaller in height. 
He further explained that as the welding happened the beam softens from the heat and caused the slight tilt upward. Well, couple of issues with that and we discussed further.. Mainly I don't consider 3/4" slight..

By sight only I can see that the weld to the side frame has the tongue beam just a tad lower, meaning the entire beam is tilting up and there just wasn't enough care to set it level before welding it.. 

Mine seems to be just a craftsmanship issue. He did explain to me (and why he came to me) that he has encountered several 'bent' tongue frames. Two main reasons have gave: Overloading & misuse of a Load Leveling hitch. First one we all knew, second I had feared to be true.


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