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jato View Drop Down
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Direct Link To This Post Topic: Putting things into Perspective
    Posted: 23 Apr 2020 at 8:04pm
After reading the last few threads under the topic of "Urgent Petitions to keep RV Campgrounds Open" and seeing a lot of figures and numbers presented I wish to add this to keep it all in proper perspective.  I was able to speak at length with my doctor today and she gave me the following information:

WORLDWIDE DEATHS THIS YEAR  01/01/2020 - 04/01/2020

10,670,908 deaths from abortion
  2,807,866 deaths from starvation
  2,061,853 deaths from cancer
  1,254,997 deaths from smoking
     422,032 deaths from HIV/AIDS
     338,886 deaths from traffic fatalities
     269,209 deaths from suicide
     246,250 deaths from malaria
     211,416 deaths from unclean drinking water
     122,062 deaths from influenza (flu)
       46,491 deaths from coronavirus

Praying and hoping we can work together as a team to curb all these unfortunate deaths.
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marwayne View Drop Down
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 Apr 2020 at 8:41pm
Jato, I don't think you have your numbers quite right, The number of death in the US alone is almost 60000 
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CharlieM View Drop Down
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 Apr 2020 at 10:25pm
As of tonight the news networks are reporting worldwide Coronavirus deaths approaching 200K and US deaths approaching 50K and it's only a few months old.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 Apr 2020 at 11:02pm
If anyone has any doubts about the power of a virus to kill, there are a number of videos about the history of the 1918-19 flu epidemic.  These things go on for a couple of years or more before they fade into the less lethal background diseases.  It infected 500,000,000 (a third of the world's population) people and killed about 50,000,000 and some say as many as 100,000,000 people (there is no clear number because no one really knows).  

Successful defeat of a pathogen like SARS-CoV-2 requires drastic steps or we will find ourselves with another pandemic of staggering proportions.  For those who like to gamble with their own life, I really don't care, but when you gamble with your neighbors lives and mine, then stay, as the song says, stay the F. at home.  You may have your own rights to do what you want, but you don't have the right to kill your neighbors.  Like the 1918-19 pandemic, this virus is a sneaker spreading to others long before the infected person knows s/he's infected.  And with an Ro of about 2.6, this thing can spread exponentially.  No sane person would attend group functions unless he simply doesn't care about his fellow man.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24 Apr 2020 at 3:13am
Originally posted by marwayne

Jato, I don't think you have your numbers quite right, The number of death in the US alone is almost 60000 

The point of the post is obviously purely political: to say that abortions kill more than everything else put together. But, yeah, I don't know what any of the real numbers are but I'd find them more credible if they were rounded to the nearest thousand.  I doubt any knows exactly how many people died from any of these causes. All that is aside from the ongoing debate about Choice.

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jato View Drop Down
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24 Apr 2020 at 5:26am
Originally posted by CharlieM

As of tonight the news networks are reporting worldwide Coronavirus deaths approaching 200K and US deaths approaching 50K and it's only a few months old.


Charlie, you are correct.  Please note the figures given were through the end of March, in other words the first three months of 2020.  Yes CV-19 deaths have risen dramatically in the past 3 weeks, and I would suppose the death rates of the other categories have risen as well.

Good news from Newser this morning stating that no new CV-19 cases for 6 days in the Province of Newfoundland, hopefully, we will be seeing other good news about this deadly virus in the days ahead.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24 Apr 2020 at 8:45am
Originally posted by Tars Tarkas


The point of the post is obviously purely political: to say that abortions kill more than everything else put together. But, yeah, I don't know what any of the real numbers are but I'd find them more credible if they were rounded to the nearest thousand.  I doubt any knows exactly how many people died from any of these causes. All that is aside from the ongoing debate about Choice.


I concur. To include abortions on a list of human death statistics is in itself an expression of a religious and/or a political opinion and has no place on this forum in my opinion. There is probably no single issue more divisive. 

Here are the most recent US annual disease fatality rates from the CDC website:

  • Heart disease: 647,457
  • Cancer: 599,108
  • Accidents (unintentional injuries): 169,936
  • Chronic lower respiratory diseases: 160,201
  • Stroke (cerebrovascular diseases): 146,383
  • Alzheimer’s disease: 121,404
  • Diabetes: 83,564
  • Influenza and Pneumonia: 55,672
  • Nephritis, nephrotic syndrome and nephrosis: 50,633
  • Intentional self-harm (suicide): 47,173
Of the accidents, 38K were auto accidents
 
Then we have:
Opioids: 47K
Homicide: 20K
HIV: 16K

Covid is at 50K and rising, so it is already at or ahead of opioids, HIV, homicide, suicide, auto accidents, influenza, and will end up ahead of all but heart disease, cancer, stroke, alzheimer's, lower respiratory disease, and maybe diabetes. 

But heart disease, cancer, stroke, alzheimer's, COPD, and diabetes are not contagious diseases, and that is a huge difference in terms of response. Public health organizations, quarantines and contact tracing used to be a very important and accepted function of government, but that has withered since the advent of all the vaccines and treatments which have made the contagious diseases the oldest of us recall from our childhoods mostly obsolete.

So now we need to rebuild that government infrastructure, and sadly, like seemingly everything else in America these days, management of a global pandemic has been politicized, and thereby rendered inefficient at best and ineffective at worst. Look at the last contagious disease public health crisis of significance, HIV, and recall how politicized that got. Covid is way more contagious. 
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24 Apr 2020 at 9:10am
Going to leave this open.. but.. be careful where you go with it..

All the numbers change daily.. heck, by the minute. So remember when reading this in a few days, it was as close to correct at the moment..

The covid 19 numbers cause a skewing of other numbers though (IMHO) because many of the underlying health issues of the deceased were going to kill them anyways and many of them are on that list separately. C-19 just hurried it along and put them in a lump.

Trust me when I say it's a rough ride. Some of you may have noticed a month long absence from here, by me, (maybe, maybe not, I do try to be as unobtrusive as possible, LOL) but guess why I wasn't online??

I also think C-19 will peter out here in a bit, just like the flu does every year, giving all them other death tolls time to catch up.

Go wash your hands.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24 Apr 2020 at 9:15am
+ 1 to offgrid.

Arguing that in the first few months of a pandemic the death rates are not all that high is disingenuous.  It's like arguing about the final score of a baseball game after the top half of the first inning.  As one of my favorite philosophers once said:  "It ain't over 'til it's over."  

The death rate from the flu pandemic of 1918-19 wasn't all that high in its first few months either.  Two years later, it had infected a full third of the world's population.  Here's a 40 minute review of that disaster:  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UDY5COg2P2c

We are a very long way from this pandemic being over and really should be thinking about how to manage the next one that comes along, which it inevitably will.  Life as we know it will not return to "normal."  .... and no, injecting a disinfectant into one's body will not cure SARS-CoV-2 any more than shoving a UVC light rod down one's throat.

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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24 Apr 2020 at 10:33am
If the argument is that some of the deaths shouldn't count because those folks were gonna die anyway and Covid just hurried things along, I don't agree. We don't get to choose the time of someone else's death, that is not our decision to make. I for one don't choose to put my elderly dad on the chopping block so someone can go camping, or my wife (who is pneumonia prone) on a death list so some rich guy can make a killing in the stock market. 

I expect my government to do a good job protecting us and our families, that is after all its fundamental purpose. Certainly having a functional economy is part of that, and there is absolutely a valid debate to be had there, but arguing that those sick ppl would have died anyway should not be a part of that discussion (IMHO), it will just foment more division. 

There are several examples of east Asian democracies which have successfully controlled this with very low fatality rates, without lockdowns and maintained most of their economic activity while doing so, so its not like we really need to reinvent the wheel here. We would need to adjust our expectations of personal privacy for awhile. Those east Asia democracies decided to do that after SARs in 2003 so were prepared. Small price to pay IMHO compared to what's going on now. 
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