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lostagain View Drop Down
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Direct Link To This Post Topic: Time for Camping?
    Posted: 23 Jun 2020 at 9:20am
The Conejo Grade has a 7% gradient for 5 miles with 12 curves.  U.S. Route 101, is a California state freeway/highway and is not part of the interstate system.  Generally, the CA freeways are built to interstate standards, but this road has some historical topographic issues that make reducing the grade to 6% impractical from a cost point of view.  It would require realignment and rerouting of the highway at a prohibitive cost.

I've driven that descent with our Pod and Dakota and it was not a problem.  I followed the truck speed limits and had no issues with keeping my speed under control.  In comparing my new TV and trailer to the old rig, there is really no significant difference in traveling down steep grades, at least based upon my experience.  It just requires patience and common sense. 
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 Jun 2020 at 8:55am
Regarding grades, this link might be of interest:

Maximum Grades on Colorado Mountain Passes


Also, for those of you that have careened down the west side of Floyd Hill on I-70, that's a 6% grade and about the steepest that I can recall encountering on an interstate.  Some of the grades approaching the Eisenhower Tunnel are also in that range.  I'd be interested in knowing if there are any steeper grades on any interstate.

Turns out there are.

Found this thread:

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lostagain View Drop Down
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 Jun 2020 at 7:48am
When towing, I generally follow the truck cautionary signs.  Seems to me that the braking capacity is proportionally the same, whether towing an r-Pod with a Toyota Highlander or a tractor/trailer with a load of I-beams.  Maybe that's overkill, but maybe it's also a good way not to kill your self or others.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 Jun 2020 at 7:14am
Yeah, at  a 6% grade our strawman 8000 lb rpod rig would top out at about 85 mph no braking coasting in neutral so you would have a fairly good chance of surviving that on a properly designed interstate. So I agree that interstates aren't generally going to be the worst problem. 

I wasn't thinking about interstates. There are lots of rural highways with pretty steep grades and 60-ish mph speeds. A lot of those are pretty straight and then have turns toward the bottoms when you get into the river valleys.  Those are the ones I'm most wary of. Easy to get lulled into bad decisions.  When you see those nice orange signs that say trucks use lower gear do that before entering the descent. 




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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22 Jun 2020 at 9:43pm
I could be wrong, but I think the maximum gradient allowed in the interstate highway system is 6%.  If that's the case, then a long straight 10% descent is not very likely to be encountered and highly unlikely on an interstate highway.  The 6% gradient, like the one found on the Grapevine, from my experience with our current TV and trailer, is pretty easy to manage with a low gear and occasional tapping of the brake.  If one is not cognizant of keeping one's speed under control on a long descent, then it might be best not to tow anything.  
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22 Jun 2020 at 7:23pm
Originally posted by lostagain

It isn't the interstate highways that really present the braking issues for most travel trailer towers, it's the twisty narrow, 2 lanes or less, highways that have steep descents.  

I think its the long 10%-ish grades on the higher speed roads which are really more dangerous. On a slow winding road the descent speeds are low so you are dissipating less heat in your brakes.  Plus its obvious you will need to be in a lower gear anyway in the twisties so there will be engine braking. Oh the high speed roads you're more likely to feel comfortable and rely on your brakes and not shift down, and you're dropping elevation fast because of your speed, the energy from which goes straight to heating up your brakes. A 10% grade at 60 mph is the equivalent of a 20$ grade at 30 in terms of energy release. 

Either one you have to downshift. I just use sport mode my highlander when in the mountains so I get to pick my gear myself rather than let the computer do it. 
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22 Jun 2020 at 7:09pm
Originally posted by lostagain

Here's a nice road to go down with a trailer:  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lcVVkFth99k  Looks like there are some great spots to camp for a week or 2. ... and the gradient reaches 45% on the way down, so check your brakes before you go.  Wink

Been down that road (in a jeep, no trailer). Don't recall it seeming that steep at the time but that was a long time ago. The weather in the video is typical East Hawaii, gets a couple of hundred inches of rain there a year, even more uphill at around the 3-4000 ft elevation.  

Nowhere to go trailer camping in Hawaii really. Not many rPods there I don't think LOL
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22 Jun 2020 at 12:53pm
Our Frontier, being 4WD, can be switched to 4WD low range if really needed to help hold the speed down. So far, over multiple thousand miles of towing, it has not been needed.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22 Jun 2020 at 12:43pm
It isn't the interstate highways that really present the braking issues for most travel trailer towers, it's the twisty narrow, 2 lanes or less, highways that have steep descents.  These are often the routes to some of the best places to camp.  US 550 between Silverton and Ouray, is a good example.  At it's steepest it's got about an 8% gradient with countless curves.  I've driven US 550 from Durango to Silverton and it has its own challenges, but continuing onto Ouray was not in our plan.  I suppose all you can do if you are on a road like that is keep your speed to an absolute minimum, utilizing both whatever engine braking capacity and friction brakes you can, allowing lots of time to stop along the way to let things cool down, as well as for pissed off motorcyclists to pass.  Seems to me the key is keeping your speed very low and having plenty of spare time so you won't feel rushed.

Unlike freight haulers, we have the good fortune to never really need to be in a hurry.  If we are rushed, we should avoid narrow, steep roads and take a different route.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22 Jun 2020 at 11:32am
Originally posted by furpod

 

That said.. modern gas trucks, or at least the one we have, do in fact incorporate engine braking.

In most cases, that is passive engine braking, where the automatic transmission will force a downshift if the engine rpm limiting speed will allow it, and otherwise, things are just allowed to kinda do what they do, with no additional hardware to actively retard engine RPM, other than the active downshifting.


On Black Mountain along I40, it will drop all the way to 2nd, and I may touch the brakes again 1-2 times in that 5 miles or so, but the engine braking will keep us very near the posted 55 speed limit just fine. That's 8K of truck and 6.5K of trailer, on a 6% grade.

This is EXACTLY how a tow vehicle pulling a trailer should perform, holding the desired speed on a downgrade, with the driver only using the service brakes intermittently to reduce speed slightly (or sharply if and when needed).

But the problem is for many undersized tow vehicles, light truck diesels (without exhaust braking), small gas or diesel engine motorhomes, smaller pickups pulling fifth wheels or larger travel trailers, etc, the driver does not know anything about this situation until they drop off a mountain grade and find themselves with very little engine braking effect and having to scrub speed and/or maintain a safe speed by holding their foot on the brakes for 5 or 10 miles....and that is a recipe for panic, or worse. Brake fade is not a theory, it is FACT. After brake fade comes excess heat and brake failure. This can ruin your whole day!

With the r-pods that most of us are pulling, this is not usually a major problem, but larger heavier rigs are certainly in that 'zone' of possibly not being safe with the weight they are towing.
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