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Topic ClosedYukon TV & rp-196

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Direct Link To This Post Topic: Yukon TV & rp-196
    Posted: 29 Sep 2020 at 3:00pm
Originally posted by ash

...so going 75-80mph is no problem here...

I think the consensus among trailer folks is that that's about 10-15 MPH too fast.  I keep it at 65 even on, for example, I-70 from Denver east into KS unless doing a quick pass on a two-lane.

I'll leave it to the really experienced people on here to comment further if they wish.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 Sep 2020 at 3:06pm
Originally posted by ash


The moral of the story: This trailer is super light, but it is also pretty tall. Tall and light are the perfect combination for disaster when it comes down to speed and wind. I would recommend you buy a good WDH system with sway control. It will save you from headaches and troubles down the road.


The moral of the story (other than don't tow at high speeds) is likely not that the trailer was light and tall but that empty as delivered the tongue weight is too light, right about 10% of trailer weight. That is too light. Add some weight forward to have a stable trailer, don't depend on sway control to save you.

And, a wdh is not required to address that issue, clearly the very light tongue weight is not a problem for the Yukon. Sway control is what is required. Two different things. If you want to combine them OK, but let's not confuse the two.  
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 Sep 2020 at 3:33pm
Originally posted by StephenH

I don't think the tires are rated for that fast a speed.

Westlake Trailer Tire Specs: 

  • Fits: 15" x 6" rims
  • Tire size: ST235/75R15
    • Section width: 9.3"
    • Outer diameter: 28.9"
  • Tire capacity:
    • Load range: D
    • Ply rating: 8
    • Maximum load: 2,910 lbs at 65 psi
  • Maximum speed: 75 mph (speed rating L)
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 Sep 2020 at 3:54pm
Originally posted by offgrid

 
"a wdh is not required to address that issue, clearly the very light tongue weight is not a problem for the Yukon. Sway control is what is required. Two different things. If you want to combine them OK, but let's not confuse the two."  

Because this trailer is only a single axle, it did not matter if the trailer was loaded or not. The whole set up (TV and Trailer) will bounce hard when you go over dips and cracks on the road. The WDH system actually helps make the ride more comfortable by slowing down all the up and down movements. 

I used to have to two axle travel trailer, and I never really had any issue with the whole ride bouncing up and down. With my old trailer, I only used the WDH to help with the weight distribution from the back axle of my truck to the front axle (just so that the back of my truck would not sag).
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 Sep 2020 at 4:17pm
Originally posted by ash

Westlake Trailer Tire Specs...

Same tires I have!  About 10k miles and going strong.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 Sep 2020 at 4:35pm
A wdh won't really slow down the up and down movements significantly. If the wdh had dampers it would but it doesn't, just steel bars that act as springs. In fact if you ride over say concrete highway or bridge expansion joints at a speed that matches the resonance frequency of your wdh springs combined with the mass of your trailer/tow vehicle the wdh will make the rig much more susceptible to bouncing. I've had that happen several times, on one bridge in particular with bad concrete expansion joints, the oscilations got pretty bad but stopped when I slowed down about 10 mph because the inputs not longer matched up with the rig resonance frequency. There were no oscillations on the same bridge without the wdh. 

A wdh does add a small amount of load to the trailer axle (about 100 lbs or thereabouts) so there is a minor improvement in bounce from that but it's not much. Weight loaded forward in the trailer is what will bring sway under control. I did a survey a couple of years ago and there were several reported cases of sway beginning at just about 10% tongue weight. Do add some weight on your tongue or forward part of the trailer if you haven't already. 

Think of the wdh as bringing the load on the front axle back to where it was without the trailer, returning proper steering and braking control. It's purpose is not to bring the rear of the tow vehicle up so it looks more level, that is a secondary benefit.  
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 Sep 2020 at 5:09pm
Originally posted by offgrid

 
"A wdh won't really slow down the up and down movements significantly. If the wdh had dampers it would but it doesn't, just steel bars that act as springs."

I don't know about your WDH system, but mine actually helps slow down or minimize that bouncing movement between the TV and trailer. My WDH acts as a support arm to keep the pivoting point between the TV and trailer up or leveled.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 Sep 2020 at 5:47pm
All wdh's are springs. So they increase stiffness against up and down motion at that joint. That will change the resonance frequency which is the natural frequency of up and down oscillation in the rig at that joint. Resonance frequency is proportional to the square root of k divided by m where k is the spring constant and m is the mass. So a stiffer spring which has a higher spring constant k will result in a higher resonance frequency.

To get the bouncing increasing rather that dying out you need the frequency of the inputs (say from a series of expansion joints) to match up with the resonance frequency. We've all probably experienced that in one form or another. If for example you get a loud buzzing noise from something in your vehicle when you run your engine at one particular rpm that's resonance. 

If the higher resonance frequency from adding the wdh goes above the frequency of the inputs from the expansion joints then the stiffer spring will reduce bounce. If the stiffer wdh moves the resonance frequency up to more closely match the input frequency from the joints then it will make the bouncing worse. Its kinda the luck of the draw whether it helps or makes it worse. 

That's a long winded engineering way of saying we can both be right. Wink

Back to the original discussion which was about sway. Look at this video:


There is no change in the weight of the trailer and there is no wdh, but the sway is gone when there weight is moved forward and terrible when its in the rear. That's why its important to get adequate weight on the tongue, 10% is marginal at best. 
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 Sep 2020 at 6:17pm
Thanks to everyone for the feedback and information provided, I have gained a good bit of knowledge. While I don't anticipate pulling a trailer at speeds in excess of 70mph, I do appreciate knowing that I will be 20mph, or more below where the TV and trailer are still stable. Having the additional margin is comforting. And while I don't like complexity, but in order to have a large safety margin, I believe the WDH/sway control is something I will do. 

Thanks again! This looks like a great place to hang out when not on an adventure.
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