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Topic ClosedConnecting a 100 watt solar panel to Zamp port
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Rustler View Drop Down
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Posts: 100 		Direct Link To This Post Topic: Connecting a 100 watt solar panel to Zamp port
    Posted: 07 Jun 2016 at 3:36pm
Originally posted by Don Halas

I'm close to pulling the trigger on this. First I've got to see if my current battery box has enough extra space to accommodate the charge controller mounted inside.

I'm planning on mounting one HQST 100 Watt 12 Volt Monocrystalline Flexible Solar Panel to the roof on the toe side of the Pod. If my approach works I may add a second panel on the rear side at a later date. (http://www.amazon.com/dp/B017OMTAV6/ref=wl_it_dp_o_pC_nS_ttl?_encoding=UTF8&colid=1OFFIBLM4EPOJ&coliid=I180JN9A4WMLPF&psc=1). I'm going to run the wire down the front of the pod directly into the battery box and not use the zamp port on the back. I plan on attaching the panel using 1/2" VHB tape and then using Dicor sealant around the entire panel. Wires will be secured using wire cable clips that I hope will be adequately mounted using command strips. If the command strips fail it shouldn't be a big deal to find a suitable alternative.

I hope to mount a Morningstar SS 20L 12V SunSaver 20 amp 12 volt Solar Charge Controller with LVD controller inside the battery box. It's a little over sized for the one panel, but I believe allows me the option of adding the second panel in series with the first panel. It's supposed to be good for exterior applications. (http://www.amazon.com/dp/B017OA5DH8/ref=wl_it_dp_o_pC_nS_ttl?_encoding=UTF8&colid=1OFFIBLM4EPOJ&coliid=I18UBPLNOQR164)

I'm guessing a 20 amp fuse between the charger and battery should suffice.   

Any thoughts or guidance will, as always be appreciated.





The following link has more than you want to know about solar systems and the National Electric Code.
Russ
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JandL View Drop Down
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Posts: 364 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07 Jun 2016 at 4:07pm
The reason I pick the Grape Solar for warranty information is because Renogy has discontinued there flexible panel. The Hqst panel only has a 1 year warranty
JandL
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CharlieM View Drop Down
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Posts: 1797 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07 Jun 2016 at 4:33pm
Originally posted by Don Halas


I hope to mount a Morningstar SS 20L 12V SunSaver 20 amp 12 volt Solar Charge Controller with LVD controller inside the battery box. It's a little over sized for the one panel, but I believe allows me the option of adding the second panel in series with the first panel.

With a 12V battery the maximum panel input is 25V. A second panel should be connected in parallel, not series.
Charlie
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Posts: 202 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07 Jun 2016 at 5:50pm
Originally posted by CharlieM

Originally posted by Don Halas


I hope to mount a Morningstar SS 20L 12V SunSaver 20 amp 12 volt Solar Charge Controller with LVD controller inside the battery box. It's a little over sized for the one panel, but I believe allows me the option of adding the second panel in series with the first panel.

With a 12V battery the maximum panel input is 25V. A second panel should be connected in parallel, not series.

OK, so without flaming me :).....I read somewhere that it is preferable to connect two panels (or more) in series since a higher voltage and lower amperage can use a lighter gauge wire, and less loss of power over a greater length of cable?
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CharlieM View Drop Down
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Posts: 1797 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07 Jun 2016 at 6:24pm
No flames here. Just cool specs. The specs on the SS-20L-12V only allow a max solar voltage of 30V. Most solar chargers have a max input to output delta limit. The open circuit voltage of a 12V panel is typically ~18V so two in series would be 36V. You are correct that series panels require smaller wire due to lower current, but the controller has to be designed for that. An MPPT controller will allow that higher input, but the SS 20 L will not.

All that said, there is an advantage to parallel connection. If one panel is shaded or partially shaded it's output will drastically drop. In a parallel connection that will only affect one panel. In a series connection it will affect the whole array. On the other hand, in low light conditions the series connection will produce more usable power, but only with an MPPT controller.  Which is best? As they say "It depends".
Charlie
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Posts: 100 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07 Jun 2016 at 7:53pm
Originally posted by CharlieM

No flames here. Just cool specs. The specs on the SS-20L-12V only allow a max solar voltage of 30V. Most solar chargers have a max input to output delta limit. The open circuit voltage of a 12V panel is typically ~18V so two in series would be 36V. You are correct that series panels require smaller wire due to lower current, but the controller has to be designed for that. An MPPT controller will allow that higher input, but the SS 20 L will not.

All that said, there is an advantage to parallel connection. If one panel is shaded or partially shaded it's output will drastically drop. In a parallel connection that will only affect one panel. In a series connection it will affect the whole array. On the other hand, in low light conditions the series connection will produce more usable power, but only with an MPPT controller.  Which is best? As they say "It depends".

Good solid information you've shared here, Charlie. There is another thread that is current which discusses the tradeoffs between PWM and MPPT controllers. Certainly the latter are more expensive as is most everything solar. There is a tendency for a person to prefer what has already been purchased. I fall in that category preferring the MPPT controller I own. My way of thinking is that one may buy a certain size solar panel (say 100 watts) based on available funds and mounting space. If you were to dry camp for an extended stay, a PWM controller might not keep up with the load. Just a possible scenario. I'll be dry camping four days later this month. With the temperatures in the high eighties to low nineties (and no shade), I'll be utilizing a Fantastic Endless Breeze fan to keep comfortable. The 13+ amps of charge current should be able to keep up with expected loads

One other benefit to the MPPT controllers is that they allow using higher voltage panels, which can at times be cheaper. Also the higher voltage between the solar panel and controller will have lower current at the same power level. This will allow smaller cheaper wires. In the case of my 185 watt 36-volt panel it can have up to a 75 foot, 10 gauge cable feeding the controller and still have reasonable (less than 3%) voltage drop. The controller adjusts voltage to the maximum power point, then converts the output voltage to what is needed for battery charging. A 12-volt panel (running at 18-22 volts) would need a larger gauge wire or a shorter one to have the same voltage drop. 

Like many things there are tradeoffs.
Russ
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Posts: 281 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07 Jun 2016 at 9:01pm
Originally posted by Don Halas


My primary reason for this is to not have to drag the extension cords across my driveway while the Pod sits there most of the time.


Good enough reason
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Posts: 1797 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07 Jun 2016 at 10:21pm
Rustler,

No need to convince me on MPPT. If and when I do solar I will go MPPT immediately. I want the most AH from the smallest panel, with the shortest sunlight period, even in partial shade. Trying to save a hundred bucks with PWM is not my way of thinking. Real estate for panels is limited, storage space is limited, and trailer positioning in wide open space is not desirable. Ergo I will opt for MPPT. Saving controller money so you can buy another panel may be OK on a house, but not on a camper IMO. That's my story and I'm stickin' to it Wink .
Charlie
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Rustler View Drop Down
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Posts: 100 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 Jun 2016 at 3:48am
Originally posted by CharlieM

Rustler,

No need to convince me on MPPT. If and when I do solar I will go MPPT immediately. I want the most AH from the smallest panel, with the shortest sunlight period, even in partial shade. Trying to save a hundred bucks with PWM is not my way of thinking. Real estate for panels is limited, storage space is limited, and trailer positioning in wide open space is not desirable. Ergo I will opt for MPPT. Saving controller money so you can buy another panel may be OK on a house, but not on a camper IMO. That's my story and I'm stickin' to it Wink .

That's my way of thinking as well. Also a high voltage solar panel (i.e. 36 volts) with a MPPT controller gives option for placing the solar panel on a portable ground mount away from the shade that's helping keep the camper cool. The high voltage between solar panel and controller will have lower amps with smaller cheaper wires. Of course the possibility of solar panel theft needs to be addressed. With mine I have a stainless steel cable that can be secured to a tree and solar panel. But even then a determined thief can still make off with it.
Russ
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Posts: 190 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 Jun 2016 at 8:10am
I've received my solar panel, charge controller, cables and connectors. I've also got all the other incidental hardware I anticipate needing to put this together including the VHB tape and Dicor which I intended to use to semi-permanently mount the solar panel to the top of the pod.

I'm rethinking the panel mounting. It is a semi-flexible material .2" thick, weighs 4 lbs. and the manufacturer even suggests using Velcro as an attachment device.

So depending upon its flexibility and how well suited it will be to the curve on the top of the POD I'm considering using Velcro strips instead of the VHB tape.

As I've stated before I do not intend to store the panel or remove it when travelling and re-attach when setting up. I'd move it only as the season changes and the sun moves closer to the horizon.

I am now planning on installing Velcro along the entire edge of all sides of the panel. This will help ensure it staying put on the road and in the event of heavy wind. I'm planning on installing about 4' of Velcro vertically for the sides and 5 strips horizontally that will allow three distinct mounts.

Anyone have any thoughts or real concerns in this? Also I'm thinking clear vrs. black Velcro, but not sure what the clear might look like weathered.

I'm going to hook up everything this weekend, but won't make a panel mount decision until I've tested the system for a week or two. I'll post some photos of the install if anyone would be interested.

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