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Trailer/Battery is positive-ground?

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Forum Name: I need HELP!!!
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URL: http://www.rpod-owners.com/forum_posts.asp?TID=12788
Printed Date: 29 Apr 2024 at 8:41am
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Topic: Trailer/Battery is positive-ground?
Posted By: ChrisSuter
Subject: Trailer/Battery is positive-ground?
Date Posted: 23 Apr 2019 at 2:09am
My fiancee and I just got ourselves a used 2010 R-Pod 173T. We took it out for it's maiden voyage (for us) this weekend and found something odd with the battery. We hooked up our solar panel per the instructions (positive solar alligator clip to positive battery terminal and negative to negative), but kept getting the error message "Solar good, battery reversed" on our solar controller. We switched the jumper clips so that positive clip from solar connected to negative of battery, and the error message disappeared, the panel started to work flowing beautiful solar energy. Upon further investigation, we found that the wire leading from the positive post of the battery is actually grounded to the metal chassis of the trailer. The red wire that leads to the trailer electronics is actually connected to the negative battery terminal. Soon-to-be Father-in-Law had never heard of a trailer set up this way. So we're confused.

I have three questions stemming from this. First, is it supposed to be this way? I have a hard time believing it is, since in my research over the past two days it seems that (apart from phone systems) positive grounding hasn't really been used since the 1960's. Second, if it's not, could it be damaging the electronic components of the trailer? My guess is that at some point the previous owners changed the battery and messed up when reinstalling the battery connections. We're probably going to be replacing the battery and some of the electronics in the near future, should we go put the ground wire on the negative post?



Replies:
Posted By: StephenH
Date Posted: 23 Apr 2019 at 7:02am
Before you do anything, check the power panel to see how that is wired. If you reverse the connections on the battery, it will blow the two 40A fuses to protect the converter from a reverse polarity situation which it looks like you have. You could try disconnecting both wires and connecting your solar charger to the battery the proper way.

Mine is white=negative, red=positive. I have a disconnect switch wired in so I don't have to disconnect the batteries (dual 6V) if I will be without shore power for storage or service. It is on the negative between the negative terminal  on the second battery and the white wire. The red is on the positive terminal of the other battery and there is a jumper between the negative of the first battery (red wire) and the positive of the second battery (white wire) so my dual 6V batteries give me 12V.


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StephenH
Happy is the man that findeth wisdom,...

http://www.rpod-owners.com/forum_posts.asp?TID=7712 - ouR escaPOD mods
Former RPod 179
Current Cherokee Grey Wolf 24 JS


Posted By: GlueGuy
Date Posted: 23 Apr 2019 at 8:51am
+1 to what StephenH said. All of the R-pods I have looked at are negative ground. Your new pod is ~~ 9 years old, so "something happened" between 2010 and now. Your challenge is to figure out what they did.

I would disconnect from shore power and verify that all the 12V systems work properly and that it all is working with the + terminal grounded. If that's the case, then your system was reversed somewhere alone the way.


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bp
2017 R-Pod 179 Hood River
2015 Ford F150 SuperCrew 4WD 3.5L Ecoboost


Posted By: StephenH
Date Posted: 23 Apr 2019 at 9:04am
Also, yours is old enough that the lights are probably incandescent and not LED. LED light won't work if the polarity is reversed. You could get one LED bulb to put in one of the fixtures. If the LED light does not work, then that would be another confirmation that the prior owner connected the wires backward.

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StephenH
Happy is the man that findeth wisdom,...

http://www.rpod-owners.com/forum_posts.asp?TID=7712 - ouR escaPOD mods
Former RPod 179
Current Cherokee Grey Wolf 24 JS


Posted By: podwerkz
Date Posted: 23 Apr 2019 at 11:08am
That's just weird.

Not only would all of the interior polarity-sensitive components need to be reversed (converter, furnace, fridge electronics etc) but it makes me wonder how in the heck they ever got the trailer auxiliary charge line to work, or if they disconnected it, or maybe, the trailer was hooked up to an old positive-ground classic pickup? 

Or maybe they somehow electrically insulated the hitch ball from the frame of the tow vehicle?

Make sure you use a DVM to check things before you make any changes.


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r・pod 171 gone but not forgotten!


Posted By: GlueGuy
Date Posted: 23 Apr 2019 at 11:38am
Oh gosh. Good point. Your tow vehicle is almost certainly negative ground, so there are all kinds of red flags dealing with that. Double and triple check all the key points where something is connected to ground.

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bp
2017 R-Pod 179 Hood River
2015 Ford F150 SuperCrew 4WD 3.5L Ecoboost


Posted By: Tars Tarkas
Date Posted: 23 Apr 2019 at 4:17pm
Originally posted by podwerkz

or maybe, the trailer was hooked up to an old positive-ground classic pickup? 

That occurred to me too. What are the odds though?! Another very long shot is that the polarity of the battery has flipped. It can happen that an old battery can change poles. What is labeled + becomes - and vice versa. Check the polarity of the battery with a DVM just for hoots.

TT

-------------
2010 176
FJ Cruiser


Posted By: GlueGuy
Date Posted: 23 Apr 2019 at 7:34pm
Good point TT. Based on the original description, it sounds like + and - might be reversed on that battery. A DVM would verify that.

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bp
2017 R-Pod 179 Hood River
2015 Ford F150 SuperCrew 4WD 3.5L Ecoboost


Posted By: offgrid
Date Posted: 24 Apr 2019 at 7:57am
I think someone in the past just got confused and connected the battery cables improperly. That happens because your trailer is wired per the electric code wire color conventions with white as neutral like it is in your house (negative in a negative ground 12v system) and colored wire (red) as the hot (+12v) conductor. Someone expecting the automotive convention black negative/red positive got confused most likely. Happens a lot.

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1994 Chinook Concourse
1995 RV6A Experimental Aircraft
2015 Rpod 179 - sold


Posted By: Tars Tarkas
Date Posted: 28 Apr 2019 at 11:31am
I'm disappointed that the OP hasn't followed up.  If he found out what was going on, I think we'd all like to know.  If he didn't, we'd be interested in continuing to troubleshoot.

TT


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2010 176
FJ Cruiser


Posted By: GlueGuy
Date Posted: 28 Apr 2019 at 12:33pm
Yah. Stuff happens. We may never know what happened here, but it sure was curious.

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bp
2017 R-Pod 179 Hood River
2015 Ford F150 SuperCrew 4WD 3.5L Ecoboost


Posted By: podwerkz
Date Posted: 28 Apr 2019 at 1:24pm
Originally posted by offgrid

I think someone in the past just got confused and connected the battery cables improperly. 

If they did that when the battery was healthy and fully charged, it probably damaged the converter or at least blew some fuses. The electronic control boards in things like the fridge and the furnace and water heater might be fried as well.

If the battery was completely dead, and if the cells are dry, then the battery is 'open', so when it was hooked up just for a quick driveway sale, probably nothing was harmed, but nothing would work.


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r・pod 171 gone but not forgotten!


Posted By: offgrid
Date Posted: 28 Apr 2019 at 2:14pm
Originally posted by podwerkz

 

If they did that when the battery was healthy and fully charged, it probably damaged the converter or at least blew some fuses. The electronic control boards in things like the fridge and the furnace and water heater might be fried as well.

If the battery was completely dead, and if the cells are dry, then the battery is 'open', so when it was hooked up just for a quick driveway sale, probably nothing was harmed, but nothing would work.

Yes, I agree.  You can see from the pics that indeed the + battery terminal is connected to the white conductor, which going to the frame. So yep, I would expect that at the very least there would be open fuses in the charger circuit as those are there for reverse polarity protection. I've seen some comments on other sites that when folks have accidentally reversed the battery connections those have blown and protected everything else so maybe that's all that would happen,  but that is something I don't personally ever want to find out Disapprove


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1994 Chinook Concourse
1995 RV6A Experimental Aircraft
2015 Rpod 179 - sold


Posted By: ChrisSuter
Date Posted: 09 Sep 2019 at 9:27am
Thanks for all the suggestions. We contacted the previous owner and they said they hadn't done it on purpose and hadn't made any electrical changes. We replaced the battery, hooked it up the normal way (red to positive, white ground to battery negative) and everything has worked fine. So, we're all good, just a weird thing.


Posted By: Motor7
Date Posted: 09 Sep 2019 at 2:04pm
I'm stumped, how could that have not fried things on the pod?

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2016 R-Pod 176T


Posted By: StephenH
Date Posted: 09 Sep 2019 at 8:42pm
If the battery were dead when it was connected, that could explain why things weren't fried.

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StephenH
Happy is the man that findeth wisdom,...

http://www.rpod-owners.com/forum_posts.asp?TID=7712 - ouR escaPOD mods
Former RPod 179
Current Cherokee Grey Wolf 24 JS


Posted By: GlueGuy
Date Posted: 10 Sep 2019 at 10:04am
Yeah. That would do it. The battery was toast & whoever just connected it up to sell it. 

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bp
2017 R-Pod 179 Hood River
2015 Ford F150 SuperCrew 4WD 3.5L Ecoboost



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