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Boondocking Power

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Forum Name: Mods, Maintenance, Tips and Tricks
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URL: http://www.rpod-owners.com/forum_posts.asp?TID=13138
Printed Date: 25 Apr 2024 at 4:44am
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Topic: Boondocking Power
Posted By: 176turbodiesel
Subject: Boondocking Power
Date Posted: 26 Aug 2019 at 9:45am

Hello!
Just finished up a 28 day adventure with my wife and 2 under 5 kids. We made it.
We stayed at 2 campgrounds without hook ups. My question is, what does the water pump draw and is it 12v and 110v? I am looking into the goal zero 1000w lithium to power the camper (no ac of course) but maybe I should just power up a second battery and run a generator for the 12v system. Help!



Replies:
Posted By: furpod
Date Posted: 26 Aug 2019 at 10:14am
The water pump is 12v, it does not draw but 3 amps. Dual 6v GC2 batteries is the best d/c storage you can get on the tongue without modifications. Switching to dual GC2's from your (probably) single group 24, will nearly quadruple your usable 12v storage, for about $300..

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Posted By: 176turbodiesel
Date Posted: 26 Aug 2019 at 1:41pm
THANKS!
I own a Honda 2000w generator. I was think of using a battery tender to charge the battery on the go. I also think I can wire it to charge when the car is running.


Posted By: StephenH
Date Posted: 26 Aug 2019 at 4:18pm
One caveat t to using the vehicle to charge: Be sure to run the refrigerator on propane as many vehicles cannot both charge the RPod's battery/batteries and run the refrigerator at the same time. It is better to arrive at the campsite with fully charged batteries and use propane for the refrigerator than to use 12V from the vehicle to run the refrigerator and find that the batteries are not charged enough for your stay.

-------------
StephenH
Happy is the man that findeth wisdom,...

http://www.rpod-owners.com/forum_posts.asp?TID=7712 - ouR escaPOD mods
Former RPod 179
Current Cherokee Grey Wolf 24 JS


Posted By: 176turbodiesel
Date Posted: 26 Aug 2019 at 6:46pm

I hope to stack as many batteries as possible on my trailer's tongue and charge them before a trip. If I ran out of juice then I would pull out the generator and recharge the batteries. Our style has been to use the propane for everything possible, we just had the experience of totally draining our one battery and all the beeping happening at 2am. Thanks for the help and feedback!


Posted By: StephenH
Date Posted: 26 Aug 2019 at 7:23pm
The lithium you mentioned would be nice, albeit a bit spendy. If you can afford it, that is likely the way to go although you would need to change converters to one that could be programmed for the Lithium batteries. I don't think the stock WFCO converter is suitable for LiFePO4 batteries. It works well for the dual 6V batteries I use. I can get multiple days from them, even with running my CPAP and fans for air circulation. Lights are insignificant since they are LED. The refrigerator has small fans inside plus the fans I added outside to help with hot weather cooling.


-------------
StephenH
Happy is the man that findeth wisdom,...

http://www.rpod-owners.com/forum_posts.asp?TID=7712 - ouR escaPOD mods
Former RPod 179
Current Cherokee Grey Wolf 24 JS


Posted By: 176turbodiesel
Date Posted: 26 Aug 2019 at 7:44pm
Thanks. It's a how many batteries you can fit on the tray that dictates the 6V in series? I saw a pure sign wave inverter that took in 24v and put out 110v for around $400. The issue is that we could get away with the 12v system and some propane for all of the summer camping. I could weld another bar on the tounge to support 3 12v batteries and use them through a switch. Once we park our pod we tend to drive places, so I can charge all the phones and tablets, so this could be a relatively simple solution, back up batteries that work with the existing inverter.


Posted By: Tars Tarkas
Date Posted: 26 Aug 2019 at 8:24pm
Originally posted by 176turbodiesel

THANKS!
I own a Honda 2000w generator. I was think of using a battery tender to charge the battery on the go. I also think I can wire it to charge when the car is running.

Why not just plug the pod into the generator and let the onboard converter charge your battery(ies) a couple of hours a day?  Plus, you have 120v power for the duration. That, and a 100w Renogy solar suitcase should keep you going as long as you want with however many batteries you have.

The Goal Zero thing is basically just another battery with a buil-in inverter.  it will need charging on a regular basis, depending on how much you use it.  You're back to needing your generator or a solar panel.

TT


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2010 176
FJ Cruiser


Posted By: StephenH
Date Posted: 26 Aug 2019 at 11:46pm
I agree. No more than 2 6V batteries on the tongue. Otherwise, you are adding a lot of excess weight that the A frame is likely not strong enough to carry. I'm not an engineer, but I can see trouble if you try to pack too many batteries there. Bring your generator and run it a couple of hours a day to charge through the converter. With that generator, you won't be able to run the AC at the same time as the converter is charging the battery/batteries, but you might get away with running the microwave.


-------------
StephenH
Happy is the man that findeth wisdom,...

http://www.rpod-owners.com/forum_posts.asp?TID=7712 - ouR escaPOD mods
Former RPod 179
Current Cherokee Grey Wolf 24 JS


Posted By: offgrid
Date Posted: 27 Aug 2019 at 6:28am
 I don't know which rPod  and tow vehicle you have but my 179's tongue weight is already over 500 lbs with dual GC2's and a full fresh water tank and propane tank. 

You need to stick with a 12V battery bank because your entire dc electrical systems is 12V. Its better to connect batteries is series than in parallel because they charge and discharge more evenly, so that leads you to a 2 series 6V system.  The GC2 case size is the largest that fits in the existing rack and 2 of those add about 130 lbs to your unloaded tongue weight, which is a lot.

My water pump uses 5 amps. But it is on so little that it is not a significant energy user.  Its simplest way to calculate energy use in a battery system is in amp hours. Here is my daily summertime battery use for example.  it's warm in NC in the summer so I'm running my bathroom fan a lot and I have a couple of portable 12V fans. if I wasn't running those the load would be much lower.  

item dc current quantity hours daily load
single led lite 0.2 4.0 2 1.6
dual led lite 0.4 1.0 2 0.8
bath lite 0.3 1.0 0.2 0.06
outside lite 1.4 1.0 0.1 0.14
small clip on fan 0.5 2.0 12.0 12
fantastic fan h 2.8 1.0 12.0 33.6
fantastic fan m 1.9 2.0 0 0
fantastic fan l 1.3 1.0 0 0
fridge 12V 10.7 1.0 0 0
water pump 5.0 1.0 0.2 1
TV  12V 1.5 1.0 4 6
Stereo 0.4 1.0 8 3.2
heater on 2.0 1.0 0 0
water heater on  0.6 1.0 1 0.6
total daily ah 59.0


So, I can go about 2 days between recharges on my 230 amphour battery pack (don't take lead acid batteries below about 50% state of charge on a regular basis unless you want to replace them frequently). If you need more capacity than the usable 100-110 amphours or so in dual GC2's then either go with lithium or provide a charging source. As you already have the Honda and it appears like you usually have hookups I suggest that you just use that and recharge with the on board charger that came with your rPod. 

If you are planning for longer boondocking adventures and you don't generally camp in deep forest then you can consider adding a 100-160 watt solar module plus charge controller. It does not need to come from any particular manufacturer. That will extend your boondocking dwell time and might eliminate generator use entirely if you're not running the cooling fans or furnace a lot.

If you're considering getting an inverter then think about what 120vac loads you want to be able to run. Forget running the a/c that way, it uses way too much energy. Its possible to run the microwave for very limited times from the battery via an inverter but you need a large inverter. The rest of the stuff that came with your trailer all runs on 12V except the TV, which you can inexpensively replace with a dual voltage one, That is more reliable and efficient than using an inverter. 




-------------
1994 Chinook Concourse
1995 RV6A Experimental Aircraft
2015 Rpod 179 - sold


Posted By: 176turbodiesel
Date Posted: 29 Aug 2019 at 6:30pm
Do you all take your batteries off of your trailers and store them indoors for the winter? I live on the east coast and store my trailer from October to March. Seems like you would get a lot out of the batteries if you used them all year long, whether you were camping or hooked up to a load bank.


Posted By: 176turbodiesel
Date Posted: 29 Aug 2019 at 8:03pm
Do you remove your batteries from your rpod in the winter?


Posted By: StephenH
Date Posted: 29 Aug 2019 at 9:49pm
Mine stay in our RPod all year long. A fully charged battery is in no danger of freezing until the temperature is lower than -77F. At 75% charge, it is -35F. Even at 50%, the freezing point is -10F. I installed a 30A RV outlet so the RPod could stay plugged in and keep the batteries fully charged. I go out from time to time and make sure the electrolyte level is adequate and add distilled water as needed.

-------------
StephenH
Happy is the man that findeth wisdom,...

http://www.rpod-owners.com/forum_posts.asp?TID=7712 - ouR escaPOD mods
Former RPod 179
Current Cherokee Grey Wolf 24 JS


Posted By: offgrid
Date Posted: 30 Aug 2019 at 6:20am
I too  just leave mine on the charger and check the water level monthly. 

You are right that if you just take the batteries out and store them without maintaining charge you can run into trouble. Lead acid batteries self discharge and the warmer it is the faster the self discharge is. So folks that live in cold climates tend to have better results if they charge the batteries once and store them for the winter than folks who store them in a warmer climate do. But it doesn't hurt anything to leave them on a charger if you have access to power (grid or solar) and keep them full of distilled water. 

As far as deliberately cycling them on a load bank, no, that doesn't prolong battery life. The battery plates are stressed every time you cycle them so the less cycles and the shallower the cycles the longer they will last. So if you're boondocking for several days and you need to recharge on a genny  it's better to recharge daily for a shorter time than to run 2-3 days and then recharge for a longer time. 


-------------
1994 Chinook Concourse
1995 RV6A Experimental Aircraft
2015 Rpod 179 - sold


Posted By: Olddawgsrule
Date Posted: 31 Aug 2019 at 3:03pm
Originally posted by offgrid

 

item dc current quantity hours daily load
single led lite 0.2 4.0 2 1.6
dual led lite 0.4 1.0 2 0.8
bath lite 0.3 1.0 0.2 0.06
outside lite 1.4 1.0 0.1 0.14
small clip on fan 0.5 2.0 12.0 12
fantastic fan h 2.8 1.0 12.0 33.6
fantastic fan m 1.9 2.0 0 0
fantastic fan l 1.3 1.0 0 0
fridge 12V 10.7 1.0 0 0
water pump 5.0 1.0 0.2 1
TV  12V 1.5 1.0 4 6
Stereo 0.4 1.0 8 3.2
heater on 2.0 1.0 0 0
water heater on  0.6 1.0 1 0.6
total daily ah 59.0


What Offgrid has done here is what I call a Power Audit. I advise anyone that wish to 'dry-camp' to do one. Such great info here at your finger tips! Great job Offgrid!

I go a bit differently and my usage is only 27ah max. Typical/average closer to 12/20ah. 

Everyone has there own way of camping and what they require to run. I suggest you run one of these as well.
I also have dual 6v's at 210ah deliverable, yet safety/conservatively only 105ah to be used. I will add that AGM's/Gel's can go as deep as 70% without causing any issues, yet 6v's are your best bet if you require going deeper. I've yet to go below 75% SOC with with my panels and re-charge from my TV. 
We travel months at a time, not just a weekend..

I do have a portable lithium battery that states 100ah (wish it really was) and rates out only at 35ah. Still a very nice secondary source of power not using the house batteries. 

'My' only item of issue to re-charge is my laptop. That is 'our' entertainment system (as well as all else a laptop does). It requires 19v to charge. My intention is to buy one of these, not necessarily this one, yet something like. I'm attempting to ensure it sine wave.. 
http://www.amazon.com/uxcell-Converter-Regulator-Waterproof-Transformer/dp/B01H97ETP8/ref=sr_1_3?crid=20OG6Q6Q7OKOY&keywords=12v+to+19v+dc+step+up+converter&qid=1567281631&s=gateway&sprefix=12v+to+19v%2Caps%2C219&sr=8-3 - http://www.amazon.com/uxcell-Converter-Regulator-Waterproof- http://www.amazon.com/uxcell-Converter-Regulator-Waterproof-Transformer/dp/B01H97ETP8/ref=sr_1_3?crid=20OG6Q6Q7OKOY&keywords=12v+to+19v+dc+step+up+converter&qid=1567281631&s=gateway&sprefix=12v+to+19v%2Caps%2C219&sr=8-3 - Transformer/dp/B01H97ETP8/ref=sr_1_3?crid=20OG6Q6Q7OKOY&keywords=12v+to+19v+dc+step+up+converter&qid=1567281631&s=gateway&sprefix=12v+to+19v%2Caps%2C219&sr=8-3
  


-------------
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCJduGeZNFgtptH67leItRFQ - Byways no Highways
2017 Tacoma
http://tnttt.com/viewtopic.php?f=55&t=72408 - Truck Camper Build
2004 F150 My Overlander


Posted By: offgrid
Date Posted: 31 Aug 2019 at 5:33pm
Originally posted by Olddawgsrule

 

'My' only item of issue to re-charge is my laptop. That is 'our' entertainment system (as well as all else a laptop does). It requires 19v to charge. My intention is to buy one of these, not necessarily this one, yet something like. I'm attempting to ensure it sine wave.. 
http://www.amazon.com/uxcell-Converter-Regulator-Waterproof-Transformer/dp/B01H97ETP8/ref=sr_1_3?crid=20OG6Q6Q7OKOY&keywords=12v+to+19v+dc+step+up+converter&qid=1567281631&s=gateway&sprefix=12v+to+19v%2Caps%2C219&sr=8-3 - http://www.amazon.com/uxcell-Converter-Regulator-Waterproof- http://www.amazon.com/uxcell-Converter-Regulator-Waterproof-Transformer/dp/B01H97ETP8/ref=sr_1_3?crid=20OG6Q6Q7OKOY&keywords=12v+to+19v+dc+step+up+converter&qid=1567281631&s=gateway&sprefix=12v+to+19v%2Caps%2C219&sr=8-3 - Transformer/dp/B01H97ETP8/ref=sr_1_3?crid=20OG6Q6Q7OKOY&keywords=12v+to+19v+dc+step+up+converter&qid=1567281631&s=gateway&sprefix=12v+to+19v%2Caps%2C219&sr=8-3
  

Thanks Olddawgsrule. I;m around the same as you if I go to the mountains and don't use the fans. But its too hot in coastal NC to do that here.

Re that device, its a dc dc converter not a transformer so its not sine wave. If your laptop takes 19Vdc then it should work OK, Just watch that it doesn't overcharge the laptop battery. Probably it won'charge the laptop battery at all. And of course be sure that you get the polarity right. 




-------------
1994 Chinook Concourse
1995 RV6A Experimental Aircraft
2015 Rpod 179 - sold


Posted By: Olddawgsrule
Date Posted: 01 Sep 2019 at 8:22am
Originally posted by offgrid

[QUOTE=Olddawgsrule] 

Re that device, its a dc dc converter not a transformer so its not sine wave. If your laptop takes 19Vdc then it should work OK, Just watch that it doesn't overcharge the laptop battery. Probably it won'charge the laptop battery at all. And of course be sure that you get the polarity right. 


"its a dc dc converter not a transformer so its not sine wave."
And you are correct again! Overlooked that factoid.. Currently use my Wagen inverter to re-charge it.

"Just watch that it doesn't overcharge the laptop battery"
Shouldn't, I do believe the charge controller is built in the laptop. Main concern there is to match up amperage. There are smaller modules out there that produce 2a to 5a. That was the concern of the Tech at the Apple Store.

"Probably it won't charge the laptop battery at all"
You have me curious on this one..

"And of course be sure that you get the polarity right"
You betcha! I'm a stickler about that! I don't take anyone else's wiring for granted..

My inverter does the job, yet seems such a waste to run for just that.. And really, it's all I use it for. Bulky, inconvenient location, loses, etc.. I drives me nuts that I go DC to AC just to go back to DC again.



-------------
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCJduGeZNFgtptH67leItRFQ - Byways no Highways
2017 Tacoma
http://tnttt.com/viewtopic.php?f=55&t=72408 - Truck Camper Build
2004 F150 My Overlander


Posted By: offgrid
Date Posted: 01 Sep 2019 at 8:47am
Originally posted by Olddawgsrule




"Probably it won't charge the laptop battery at all"
You have me curious on this one..



I'm probably jumping to a conclusion, I just looked at the Amazon reviews of the product and one guy said it ran his Dell laptop but didn't charge the laptop battery. Dell's BIOS doesn't allow battery charging from generic power supplies apparently.    But your laptop might be completely different. 

 




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1994 Chinook Concourse
1995 RV6A Experimental Aircraft
2015 Rpod 179 - sold


Posted By: Olddawgsrule
Date Posted: 01 Sep 2019 at 9:08am
Originally posted by offgrid

Originally posted by Olddawgsrule


"Probably it won't charge the laptop battery at all"
You have me curious on this one..


I'm probably jumping to a conclusion, I just looked at the Amazon reviews of the product and one guy said it ran his Dell laptop but didn't charge the laptop battery. Dell's BIOS doesn't allow battery charging from generic power supplies apparently.    But your laptop might be completely different. 


Thank you for that info. The Apple Tech was very specific about matching voltage/amperage. His statement was they don't recommend due to most really don't know how. Good folks over there! I was asked to bring in the info and he'd double check for me. 

Oh yes.. I grabbed you audit list to compare to mind and added some of your numbers. Again, good job there and thanks for sharing!

Screen shot mine using your chart.
Numbers look about right!



-------------
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCJduGeZNFgtptH67leItRFQ - Byways no Highways
2017 Tacoma
http://tnttt.com/viewtopic.php?f=55&t=72408 - Truck Camper Build
2004 F150 My Overlander


Posted By: podwerkz
Date Posted: 01 Sep 2019 at 9:17am
Just google 'car charger' and your model laptop.

(example: car charger dell abc123x)

Or enter the same words into the search box on ebay or amazon.

You will likely find a compatible DC-DC charger for your laptop, and they are usually about $20-$30 or so.


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r・pod 171 gone but not forgotten!


Posted By: Olddawgsrule
Date Posted: 01 Sep 2019 at 9:26am
Originally posted by podwerkz

Just google 'car charger' and your model laptop.

(example: car charger dell abc123x)

Or enter the same words into the search box on ebay or amazon.

You will likely find a compatible DC-DC charger for your laptop, and they are usually about $20-$30 or so.

The Apple Tech did not even recommend what they sell for a car charger.. Which is why they were insist on me showing them the info on what I find. These laptop's are pretty fussy I guess..


-------------
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCJduGeZNFgtptH67leItRFQ - Byways no Highways
2017 Tacoma
http://tnttt.com/viewtopic.php?f=55&t=72408 - Truck Camper Build
2004 F150 My Overlander



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