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Towing Speed

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Printed Date: 18 Apr 2024 at 4:14pm
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Topic: Towing Speed
Posted By: offgrid
Subject: Towing Speed
Date Posted: 25 Mar 2020 at 3:12pm
Might as well do a poll on this one...

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1994 Chinook Concourse
1995 RV6A Experimental Aircraft
2015 Rpod 179 - sold



Replies:
Posted By: lostagain
Date Posted: 25 Mar 2020 at 3:47pm
Why hurry?

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Never leave footprints behind.
Fred & Maria Kearney
Sonoma 167RB
Our Pod 172
2019 Ford F-150 4x4 2.7 EcoBoost


Posted By: mjlrpod
Date Posted: 25 Mar 2020 at 4:52pm
Maybe I should back off a little. I tend to be near 70 most of the time. I've looked down and seen 75, and immediately slow down. 

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2017.5 Rp-172
2020 R-pod 195
2015 Frontier sv 4.0L 6cyl
I'll be rpodding


Posted By: crw8sr
Date Posted: 25 Mar 2020 at 5:19pm
I think it's about safety, you can go fast but at some point you have to be able to stop; sometimes very quickly.  

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Chuck & Lyn
Izzy, Morkie. RIP
Zoe Joy & Gracie, Yorkie
2018 R Pod 190   
2019 Traverse

In moments of adversity;when life's a total wreck, I think of those worse off than me and really feel like heck.


Posted By: Wirat
Date Posted: 25 Mar 2020 at 6:50pm
Great poll idea! What, nobody in the 75-79 mph range yet??? LOL Seems like they're often passing me on the highway...but I live in Florida (God's waiting room) where we have flocks of snowbirds that migrate up and down I-95 each year. In just as much of a hurry to get here as they are to leave.

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2019 R-Pod 191


Posted By: wooleeman
Date Posted: 25 Mar 2020 at 8:46pm
I purchased my Pod used in NC ( I live in PA about a 10 hr. drive without the Pod). When returning home I was in a hurry and I found myself approaching 80 mph consistently.  When I began reading this forum I found how foolish I was especially with the C rated tires. I upgraded to Endurance D rated tires and thought why am I in such a the hurry. I rarely go over 65 now.

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2022 RP-202
2016 RP-179 (Sold 9/2020)
2014 Silverado Crew Cab. 6-1/2' Bed
Golden Retriever (DOB 6/16/2020)
English Bulldog (RIP 6/15/2020)


Posted By: Kahonu37
Date Posted: 26 Mar 2020 at 4:23am
Even though we have E rated Goodyear’s on our 179 (80 mph rating), we never go over 65 mph. As previously stated what’s the rush? Plan your trip accordingly, distance, breaks, arrival time and most of all safety.

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2018 179
2012 NISSAN XTERRA (retired 12/19)
2019 RAM 1500 WARLOCK (new)
A.R.E. V Series Topper
WDH Equalizer 600/6000


Posted By: furpod
Date Posted: 26 Mar 2020 at 8:13am
We have enough truck to tow at any speed we choose, towing pretty much anything towable.. Tires rated to 81 mph.. Still try to stay around 60-62.. it's comfortable, and I very rarely have to deal with any passing..


Posted By: Colt
Date Posted: 27 Mar 2020 at 3:09pm
My trailer's tires are rated for 65 mph sustained speeds, so I set the cruise on 62. Would never go that slow without the trailer; hurts my motor to go so slow!

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John
'16 R-Pod 180


Posted By: GlueGuy
Date Posted: 27 Mar 2020 at 6:03pm
Originally posted by Colt

My trailer's tires are rated for 65 mph sustained speeds, so I set the cruise on 62. Would never go that slow without the trailer; hurts my motor to go so slow!
I would probably argue that there is more wear on your motor at 75 than there is at 65. Might be hard to measure though (depending on the motor). At 55 MPH the motor in our F-150 is barely making 1500 RPM.


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bp
2017 R-Pod 179 Hood River
2015 Ford F150 SuperCrew 4WD 3.5L Ecoboost


Posted By: Colt
Date Posted: 27 Mar 2020 at 7:24pm
It's a song lyric. :-/

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John
'16 R-Pod 180


Posted By: GlueGuy
Date Posted: 28 Mar 2020 at 10:11am
 Confused

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bp
2017 R-Pod 179 Hood River
2015 Ford F150 SuperCrew 4WD 3.5L Ecoboost


Posted By: StephenH
Date Posted: 28 Mar 2020 at 10:32am
Generally, 60 mph with rare excursions faster (downhill, mostly). If I know there is a slower speed limit, I go that  speed, but I learned early on that faster than 60 is more stressful and definitely makes for a big hit on the gas mileage.

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StephenH
Happy is the man that findeth wisdom,...

http://www.rpod-owners.com/forum_posts.asp?TID=7712 - ouR escaPOD mods
Former RPod 179
Current Cherokee Grey Wolf 24 JS


Posted By: lostagain
Date Posted: 28 Mar 2020 at 3:40pm
Unless you are trying to outrun a storm, or on the way to labor and delivery to avoid a pod birth, what's the hurry?  Unless you are on a marathon cross-country drive, going a tad slower will only add 15 or 20 minutes to your trip, but you'll arrive a whole lot more relaxed and ready to fish.

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Never leave footprints behind.
Fred & Maria Kearney
Sonoma 167RB
Our Pod 172
2019 Ford F-150 4x4 2.7 EcoBoost


Posted By: TearlessTom
Date Posted: 07 Apr 2020 at 2:16pm
Because of all the knowledge I have gleaned from here I try to keep it at 65 and it will creep up from there to about 70 so I put my vote in there. 
However if I set the cruise control at 65 I know I am just a tad under so I shoot for just under and accept just a bit over 65.
I plan on upgrading tires before any long trips. 


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Tearless Tom
2017 R-Pod 180
2014 Ford F-150 XLT 2WD 5.0


Posted By: Our pod
Date Posted: 08 Apr 2020 at 11:03am
Drag increases with the square of the velocity. If you increase your speed from 60 mph to 66 mph (i.e., 10%), your drag increases 21% (going from 60 to 66 mph is a 10% increase or 1.1 times your original speed; and 1.1 squared is 1.21 which means your drag is 1.21 times what it was at 60 mph). The greater your speed the bigger the parachute you are towing.

So,tow slow amigo.

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Life is good.


Posted By: offgrid
Date Posted: 09 Apr 2020 at 7:29am
I'm noticing that folks' preferred towing speeds are lower that I expected. 

Just curious if actual towing speeds on the interstates are higher. I like 60 when I can do it safely but when I tow on I81 (the main 4 lane freeway through my area), the traffic on which is frequently wall to wall semis running at 70-75+, I pick up my speed to the high 60's. Being a road boulder on a congested interstate can be dangerous for everyone.


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1994 Chinook Concourse
1995 RV6A Experimental Aircraft
2015 Rpod 179 - sold


Posted By: StephenH
Date Posted: 09 Apr 2020 at 8:24am
I still tow at 60 mph. With 4 lanes, there is plenty of room for the faster traffic to get by. Of course, I am in the right lane unless there is an uphill and the semi's are running even slower than I am. That is one of the few times I pass anyone.

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StephenH
Happy is the man that findeth wisdom,...

http://www.rpod-owners.com/forum_posts.asp?TID=7712 - ouR escaPOD mods
Former RPod 179
Current Cherokee Grey Wolf 24 JS


Posted By: offgrid
Date Posted: 09 Apr 2020 at 8:36am
To be clear, by 4 lanes I meant two in each direction. On I81 that can lead to a long backup of trucks in the slow lane trying to pass me. I like to avoid that by either taking a different route or by travelling early in the morning but it's not always possible. 

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1994 Chinook Concourse
1995 RV6A Experimental Aircraft
2015 Rpod 179 - sold


Posted By: lostagain
Date Posted: 09 Apr 2020 at 9:51am
In congested traffic on a freeway with 2 lanes in each direction, 70 -75 is simply too fast for conditions.  If something happened requiring an evasive maneuver, such as a dangerous object falling from a truck, you'd be SOL.  Unfortunately, big rig drivers, often under pressure to arrive on a schedule or being paid by the mile, drive way, way too fast.  I have represented many truckers in accident cases and uniformly there are issues of impaired driving on their part; either distracted driving, drugs like amphetamines, lack of sleep (cheating the tattletale), or excessive speed for conditions.  

Offgrid's suggestion that taking a different route or traveling out of peak hours is a good idea.  The other thing we can all do, is try to give the big rigs lots of room and to help them with lane changes by making space for them to get by.


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Never leave footprints behind.
Fred & Maria Kearney
Sonoma 167RB
Our Pod 172
2019 Ford F-150 4x4 2.7 EcoBoost


Posted By: StephenH
Date Posted: 09 Apr 2020 at 10:03am
Okay, I misunderstood. With two lanes in each direction, I still drive 60. If I felt it was unsafe, I would take an alternate route. It is also best to check each state's laws regarding towing. You would be surprised to see that the Interstate speed limit is well above the legal towing speed for a number of states.
https://www.doityourselfrv.com/state-towing-speeds/ - https://www.doityourselfrv.com/state-towing-speeds/


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StephenH
Happy is the man that findeth wisdom,...

http://www.rpod-owners.com/forum_posts.asp?TID=7712 - ouR escaPOD mods
Former RPod 179
Current Cherokee Grey Wolf 24 JS


Posted By: lostagain
Date Posted: 09 Apr 2020 at 10:36am
Thanks, StephenH for the link.  Good to see most everyone prefers to drive in the range of the states' speed limits.  

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Never leave footprints behind.
Fred & Maria Kearney
Sonoma 167RB
Our Pod 172
2019 Ford F-150 4x4 2.7 EcoBoost


Posted By: offgrid
Date Posted: 09 Apr 2020 at 11:05am
Unfortunately some of those speed limits are pretty laughable. I don’t think I’ve ever seen anyone tow at 55 in VA for example. I prefer saving fuel and towing at 60-62 but I’ll choose safety over economy. If I’m holding up traffic that is more stressful and unsafe than just driving at 65-67 closer to the normal flow of traffic in the right lane. Frequently there is no good alternative route, uncontrolled access two lane highways are much less safe than the interstates if there is significant traffic.

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1994 Chinook Concourse
1995 RV6A Experimental Aircraft
2015 Rpod 179 - sold


Posted By: lostagain
Date Posted: 09 Apr 2020 at 1:12pm
After distracted driving, speeding is the most common cause of accidents according to the National Safety Council.  They are followed by drunk driving. 

Though driving significantly below the flow of traffic also poses a danger, the accidents are generally the result of faster drivers' inattention and failure to take appropriate action.  One of the most basic rules of safe driving is drive no faster than your ability to avoid an accident.  Granted, some people do not have the physical reaction ability to drive appropriately and they shouldn't be given licenses.  But, driving faster than one's ability to manage an emergency maneuver is dangerous, especially with a trailer.  Who is to blame, the person driving within the speed limit or the person breaking the law?  In all the cases I ever defended, the one driving within the rules won.  


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Never leave footprints behind.
Fred & Maria Kearney
Sonoma 167RB
Our Pod 172
2019 Ford F-150 4x4 2.7 EcoBoost


Posted By: offgrid
Date Posted: 09 Apr 2020 at 4:36pm
Say you're towing at 60. You aren't unsafe in one state that happens to have a 55 mph limit and then miraculously achieve safety when you cross the state line where the limit is 65. I acknowledge that you would most certainly lose a lawsuit though.

The physics says that the kinetic energy your rig carries (which you can think of as the damage it could do to yourself and others before coming to a stop) is 40% higher at 65 than at 55 (kinetic energy goes with the square of velocity). That is nothing to sneeze at (although I guess there is nothing we should be sneezing at these days Dead). 

But the 40% additional energy your rig is carrying is only part of the puzzle. The road and weather conditions obviously need to be considered as well of course.  But the impact you are having on other traffic, and the risk the other traffic is placing on you is critical to your safety. 

That is where the relative speed difference comes in. If you "rub" (NASCAR term) other traffic the kinetic energy being transferred is also proportional to the square of the speed, but in this case its the square of the speed difference between you and the other vehicle. So you really don't want huge speed differences between you and heavy vehicles like semis passing two feet away from you. If that semi "rubbed" you (or vice versa) and you're only going a couple mph different in speed not much is going to happen other than some cosmetic damage, but if he's passing you at a relative speed difference of of 25-30 mph its a very different story. You will be off the road (at best) in a heartbeat. 

So, if the road and weather conditions are good I will choose to drive a little faster if traffic demands it to avoid creating risk to myself and others by being a bottleneck. The day that I drive at the legal speed limit because I'm more worried about litigation than actually being safe is the day I think I will give up my driver's licence.  


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1994 Chinook Concourse
1995 RV6A Experimental Aircraft
2015 Rpod 179 - sold


Posted By: GlueGuy
Date Posted: 09 Apr 2020 at 7:14pm
Originally posted by offgrid

Unfortunately some of those speed limits are pretty laughable. I don’t think I’ve ever seen anyone tow at 55 in VA for example. I prefer saving fuel and towing at 60-62 but I’ll choose safety over economy. If I’m holding up traffic that is more stressful and unsafe than just driving at 65-67 closer to the normal flow of traffic in the right lane. Frequently there is no good alternative route, uncontrolled access two lane highways are much less safe than the interstates if there is significant traffic.
What do you mean "some"? They are all either 55 or 65 (I may have missed one or two). I didn't count, but it looked about evenly split. Which ones you want to laugh at?


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bp
2017 R-Pod 179 Hood River
2015 Ford F150 SuperCrew 4WD 3.5L Ecoboost


Posted By: lostagain
Date Posted: 09 Apr 2020 at 9:40pm
Traffic engineers are the ones who usually set the speed limits based upon their agreed upon criteria.  See for example:   http://www.ite.org/technical-resources/topics/speed-management-for-safety/setting-speed-limits/ - https://www.ite.org/technical-resources/topics/speed-management-for-safety/setting-speed-limits/   Generally, they use the 85th percentile approach which says the speed limit should be set within 5 mph, plus or minus, of the 85th percentile speed, as measured on the road.  That speed is adjusted in recognition of other road characteristics, such as alignment, parking activity, pedestrian movement, residential and commercial activity, and other factors affecting safety.

Since I am no traffic engineer and they generally know what they are doing, I'll give them the respect they earned and try to stick to within +/- 5mph of the limit.  If others don't want to wear a mask and wash their hands, well that's their issue as long as I'm not on the road with them.  When a big rig driver wants to drive 80 when the limit is 65, I'm not going to join him in his foolishness.  I'll just try to keep out of his way.

As for lawsuits, it isn't the suit that matters.  It's living with the decision of 12 ordinary people who looked at what you did and said you were were the one to blame in the fatal accident.  I wouldn't want to carry that around the rest of my life.  


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Never leave footprints behind.
Fred & Maria Kearney
Sonoma 167RB
Our Pod 172
2019 Ford F-150 4x4 2.7 EcoBoost


Posted By: offgrid
Date Posted: 10 Apr 2020 at 8:03am
Originally posted by GlueGuy

 
What do you mean "some"? They are all either 55 or 65 (I may have missed one or two). I didn't count, but it looked about evenly split. Which ones you want to laugh at?

You are right to question me, i didn't look into the numbers in that web link closely enough. I don't know where the author got is data but it is not correct. 

VA for example has a max speed limit of 70 for all vehicles, there isn't a different one for vehicles towing trailers. I should have known that as I just moved here a couple months ago and read the DMV manual. I would have remembered something like a 55 mph trailer speed limit. It doesn't exist. Yet another example of needing to be careful what one believes on the internet I guess. 

It turns out only a very few states do have different speed limits when towing. Of those, CA is the only one with the towing limit at 55. WA is 60. The others are higher. 

So, the answer is to your question is: CA is the one that is most laughable, with WA coming in second. But, what else is new?  At least in CA it is well posted and not a super top secret special speed limit. LOL.  


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1994 Chinook Concourse
1995 RV6A Experimental Aircraft
2015 Rpod 179 - sold


Posted By: lostagain
Date Posted: 10 Apr 2020 at 9:20am
It's not so clear in VA.  Read the rule:   http://law.lis.virginia.gov/vacode/title46.2/chapter8/section46.2-870/ - https://law.lis.virginia.gov/vacode/title46.2/chapter8/section46.2-870/   The only place where there is a speed limit of 70 is on a very select few highways meeting the criteria in the statute.  The rest of the time it is substantially lower, and even more so for trucks and trailer towing vehicles.  Technically it appears that trucks can go 70 on designated highways, but it appears it's legislature has ignored the reasoning that it used for having a truck speed limit lower everywhere else, probably as a result of the trucking industry lobby.  And, that 70 speed limit is tempered by the basic speed law adopted in VA. http:// www.virginiadot.org/info/faq-speedlimits.asp  -  http://www.virginiadot.org/info/faq-speedlimits.asp  So if there are any conditions that justify a lower maximum speed, you can't go 70.  You must slow down to a "reasonable" speed for the circumstances.

As for other states, there is a lot of conflicting information on the internet.  One source that may be more reliable is the AAA site: http:// drivinglaws.aaa.com/tag/trailer-speed-limits/ -  https://drivinglaws.aaa.com/tag/trailer-speed-limits/   For each of us, if we are going to drive in states where we don't know the speed limits for towing, it is our responsibility to find out.  If you can't get it from a reliable web site like AAA's, then stop at the state's welcome center as you enter and find out.  Probably it'd be a nice time to take a leak too.

As for California, I would hardly call the engineers who work for CalTrans laughable for setting a 55 mph speed limit for vehicles that are towing something.  It is insulting to those very capable engineers who have studied the situation and exercised their best judgment.  CalTrans has led the standards for road construction in much of the country and has not rolled over for the trucking industry lobby.   Would it hurt to raise the limit to 60?  Probably it would be more in line with the 85% "rule," but it's the law there whether you like it or not. 

There is a more fundamental issue underlying the issue of speed limits.  We have a big problem in this country with people thinking the law only applies to others, not to them.  Whether you like it or not, speed limits apply to you.  No one is above the law, at least so says our Constitution.  




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Never leave footprints behind.
Fred & Maria Kearney
Sonoma 167RB
Our Pod 172
2019 Ford F-150 4x4 2.7 EcoBoost


Posted By: offgrid
Date Posted: 10 Apr 2020 at 9:38am
Originally posted by lostagain

Traffic engineers are the ones who usually set the speed limits based upon their agreed upon criteria.  See for example:   http://www.ite.org/technical-resources/topics/speed-management-for-safety/setting-speed-limits/ - https://www.ite.org/technical-resources/topics/speed-management-for-safety/setting-speed-limits/   Generally, they use the 85th percentile approach which says the speed limit should be set within 5 mph, plus or minus, of the 85th percentile speed, as measured on the road.  That speed is adjusted in recognition of other road characteristics, such as alignment, parking activity, pedestrian movement, residential and commercial activity, and other factors affecting safety.

Since I am no traffic engineer and they generally know what they are doing, I'll give them the respect they earned and try to stick to within +/- 5mph of the limit.  If others don't want to wear a mask and wash their hands, well that's their issue as long as I'm not on the road with them.  When a big rig driver wants to drive 80 when the limit is 65, I'm not going to join him in his foolishness.  I'll just try to keep out of his way.

As for lawsuits, it isn't the suit that matters.  It's living with the decision of 12 ordinary people who looked at what you did and said you were were the one to blame in the fatal accident.  I wouldn't want to carry that around the rest of my life.  

Well, since CA is the only state with a statewide 55 mph limit for towing, I suppose that traffic engineers get trained differently in CA universities than in other states? But wait, I expect that max speed limits are set by legislators, not traffic engineers. Few state legislators are engineers by profession.

Re violation of statutory speed limits, I said I tow between 65-67 when conditions permit and I would otherwise be creating a hazard by impeding traffic. otherwise I tow at either 60-62 or at the posted limit for that roadway. So, in my state that is 3-5 mph under the limit, not 5 or more over the limit. I'm glad I don't tow in CA as I think creating a situation with a 15 plus mph built in speed difference between RV's and trucks and passenger vehicles is not a good idea. 




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1994 Chinook Concourse
1995 RV6A Experimental Aircraft
2015 Rpod 179 - sold


Posted By: offgrid
Date Posted: 10 Apr 2020 at 10:30am
No, sorry, you can't have super top secret speed limits. What would be the point of that? Disapprove

The situation is VA is quite simple. Here's the language from the VA DMV manual: "Unless there is a speed limit sign stating otherwise, the maximum speed limit for passenger vehicles and motorcycles is 25 MPH for school, business and residential areas; 35 MPH for unpaved roads and 55 MPH for all other roads." 

Max speed limit on rural interstates is 70, and it is posted that way, no difference whether you're towing something or not. If a freeway is posted lower than that then that's the limit. it is not that hard to figure out. My original example, I81 in SW VA, is posted at 70 for most of its length, with sections at 65 due to turns, grades, or proximity to urban areas. 

CA is the outlier here, with a 15 mph speed difference regulated in. The great majority of states have the same max speed limit towing and not, and in the few that don't its only a 5 mph difference (10 in WA). If you want to blame that on the trucking industry lobby, with CA and WA the lone outposts of sanity, I suppose you can do so. 

Not everyone would agree. For the reasons stated I think its safer to have all the traffic moving at about the same speed. There are many many studies that show that driving significantly slower than the flow of traffic is dangerous. 

Where do you get that I am towing in violation of speed laws?  You are saying that you sometimes drive +5 mph of the limit, not me. I don't tow in CA. I suppose if I ever did I'd have to make a decision about whether I could safely drive the double nickel or not, but it hasn't come up. Ying Yang


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1994 Chinook Concourse
1995 RV6A Experimental Aircraft
2015 Rpod 179 - sold


Posted By: podwerkz
Date Posted: 10 Apr 2020 at 10:47am
Those are called 'split speed limits'...and they are generally recognized as unsafe.

Yes the trucking industry has successfully lobbied many states to remove split speed limits.

When all else fails, remember this fact: split speed limits, and in fact, all speed limits, are all about generating revenue, first, and about safety, second.


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r・pod 171 gone but not forgotten!


Posted By: GlueGuy
Date Posted: 10 Apr 2020 at 11:21am
Originally posted by offgrid

CA is the outlier here, with a 15 mph speed difference regulated in. The great majority of states have the same max speed limit towing and not, and in the few that don't its only a 5 mph difference (10 in WA). If you want to blame that on the trucking industry lobby, with CA and WA the lone outposts of sanity, I suppose you can do so. 

Sorry. The delta is 10 MPH. Almost the entire state with very few exceptions has a 65 MPH limit. In very rural areas, it might be 70 or 75, but those are rare. 

That said, I usually set the cruise for 59 or maybe 60, so the delta ends up being more like 5 MPH except for scofflaws.


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bp
2017 R-Pod 179 Hood River
2015 Ford F150 SuperCrew 4WD 3.5L Ecoboost


Posted By: offgrid
Date Posted: 10 Apr 2020 at 12:03pm
Looks like CA max anywhere is 70 where posted, otherwise 65. 

The only thing I could easily find was when sections were raised to 70 from 65 back in 1996. At that point there were about 1300 miles of rural freeway raised to 70. That would be a lot of freeway in most states but not in CA. Of course, no one expects urban freeways to be posted at 70. But long stretches of the main freeways in and out of CA and up and down the central valley are at 70.

https://www.latimes.com/archives/la-xpm-1996-01-04-mn-20890-story.html - https://www.latimes.com/archives/la-xpm-1996-01-04-mn-20890-story.html



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1994 Chinook Concourse
1995 RV6A Experimental Aircraft
2015 Rpod 179 - sold


Posted By: lostagain
Date Posted: 10 Apr 2020 at 2:34pm
The list provided by StephenH lists 15 states with 55 mph trailer towing limits.  

The VA statute states:  Except as otherwise provided in this article, the maximum speed limit shall be 55 miles per hour on interstate highways or other limited access highways with divided roadways, nonlimited access highways having four or more lanes, and all state primary highways.

The maximum speed limit on all other highways shall be 55 miles per hour if the vehicle is a passenger motor vehicle, bus, pickup or panel truck, or a motorcycle, but 45 miles per hour on such highways if the vehicle is a truck, tractor truck, or combination of vehicles designed to transport property, or is a motor vehicle being used to tow a vehicle designed for self-propulsion, or a house trailer. [Emphasis added.]

Notwithstanding the foregoing provisions of this section, the maximum speed limit shall be 70 miles per hour where indicated by lawfully placed signs, erected subsequent to a traffic engineering study and analysis of available and appropriate accident and law-enforcement data, on (i) interstate highways; (ii) multilane, divided, limited access highways; and (iii) high-occupancy vehicle lanes if such lanes are physically separated from regular travel lanes. The maximum speed limit shall be 60 miles per hour where indicated by lawfully placed signs, erected subsequent to a traffic engineering study and analysis of available and appropriate accident and law-enforcement data, on U.S. Route 17, U.S. Route 23, U.S. Route 29, U.S. Route 58, U.S. Alternate Route 58, U.S. Route 301, U.S. Route 360, U.S. Route 460, U.S. Route 501 between the Town of South Boston and the North Carolina state line, State Route 3, and State Route 207 where such routes are nonlimited access, multilane, divided highways.

No doubt some places use speed limits as revenue enhancers, but in more civilized states, speed traps are illegal.  The wisdom of split speed limits is debatable and it would be interested in seeing what professional traffic engineers have to say about it.  Just as one would not hire an urologist to perform open heart surgery, though s/he may be an outstanding urologist, perhaps we should look to highly trained traffic engineers to help settle this question.

Since each state is empowered to set it's own speed limits and we don't have a national speed limit, then our obligation is to follow the speed laws of the state we're in, even if we think they are silly, inappropriate, porrly thought out, laughable, revenue enhancers, or just plane dumb.  And most states, in the last analysis, have superimposed on all their speed limits, the basic speed law; i.e., no one should drive faster than is safe for existing conditions.





-------------
Never leave footprints behind.
Fred & Maria Kearney
Sonoma 167RB
Our Pod 172
2019 Ford F-150 4x4 2.7 EcoBoost


Posted By: offgrid
Date Posted: 10 Apr 2020 at 6:46pm
So, is your interpretation that the speed limit for a semi or a passenger vehicle towing a travel trailer on i81 here in SW VA, which is posted at 70, is actually 45 mph? Better let the VA Staties know🤔. A travel trailer is not a house trailer btw.

We have established that StephenH’s link is out of date. Any number of other websites have the correct figures. Try Wikipedia or your AAA link. This one has a interesting detailed discussion.

https://rvnerds.com/resources/speed-limits-and-towing/

I agree that we need to follow the regs in our respective states. I have an issue with CA’s regs but it’s a moot point since I don’t tow a trailer there.

As for the engineering, the issue with high differential speeds is essentially that the faster or slower you drive relative to the average speed of the traffic the more vehicles you interact with and the higher the probability that you will have an accident. It’s called the Solomon curve and was first documented 50 years ago. It’s actually worse when you are going slower than the traffic than faster. Also, if you do interact with a vehicle going at a significantly different speed, the kinetic energy that could be transferred to your rig is much greater than if the speed difference is small because it goes with the square of the speed difference.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Solomon_curve


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1994 Chinook Concourse
1995 RV6A Experimental Aircraft
2015 Rpod 179 - sold


Posted By: lostagain
Date Posted: 10 Apr 2020 at 7:20pm
No, the speed limit on I81 in VA, if posted at 70, seems to apply to all vehicles.  It's 45 on some highways.  Read the statute.  I cut and pasted it as written.  As for whether it applies to an RV trailer, the statute isn't very clear.  I'd want to contact a VA lawyer, if I was worried about it.  But since the NV legislature writes things a little more clearly here, I don't have to worry about it.  We don't have a split limit.  I drive 60 if the limit is 65 and do my best to not impede others.  If I am not concerned about impeding others, I'll knock it down a nickel.  In CA, I set the cruise control to 55.  That's the law.

As for traffic engineering issues, I'll just leave it to those whose expertise and professional experience is in that field.  Like I say, no matter how well qualified a medical doctor, who is a urologist, may be, s/he isn't going to do open heart surgery on me.  So, I may grumble and whine when I have to drive slower than I'd like, but I'm going to do my best to respect the law.  


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Never leave footprints behind.
Fred & Maria Kearney
Sonoma 167RB
Our Pod 172
2019 Ford F-150 4x4 2.7 EcoBoost


Posted By: offgrid
Date Posted: 10 Apr 2020 at 9:35pm
So we agree I can legally tow at 67 on I81. I’m not violating statute and I feel safer than I would driving 60 which I would prefer to do if not for the traffic. So it’s all good. 👍

I’m personally not at all worried about the possibility of being cited for not towing at 45 on VA’s lovely secondary highways because some overzealous state trooper decides my rpod is a house trailer. I typically cruise along about 50 on those and enjoy the view anyway. So I’m not planning to contact a lawyer, a urologist or a cardiologist. Well, at least not about speed limits. 😱

BTW it looks like most of I80 east of metro Reno in NV is posted at 80, towing or not. I guess that would seriously burn up some fossil fuel.

https://www.nevadadot.com/home/showdocument?id=17053



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1994 Chinook Concourse
1995 RV6A Experimental Aircraft
2015 Rpod 179 - sold


Posted By: lostagain
Date Posted: 10 Apr 2020 at 10:07pm
The 80 limit on I-80 is new, but copies UT, 80 all the way from just west of Salt Lake to the NV state line.  Personally, I find driving that fast very uncomfortable in a Mazda cx5.  There is no way I'm driving that speed with a trailer.  I'll keep it around 60, but a 20 mph differential is just plain scary.  Far better to take US 50 to head east.  It's slower and much more interesting.  Great places to camp along the way.

My experience with the rules of the road in the original 13 colonies is that they have no sense of organization.  In NJ I had to look up some driving rules and found them mixed in with laws about utterly unrelated topics, such as a contract rule and murder laws, and there were all kinds of rules about horse drawn sleighs.  In the entire time I lived in NJ, I never saw a horse drawn sleigh on a road.  


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Never leave footprints behind.
Fred & Maria Kearney
Sonoma 167RB
Our Pod 172
2019 Ford F-150 4x4 2.7 EcoBoost


Posted By: Colt
Date Posted: 11 Apr 2020 at 1:13am
LOL! I'm on my 2nd CX-5 and wouldn't think twice about 85 on an interstate highway.   

I'm also a retired Civil Engineer. There is more politics and less engineering in speed limits than any other part of civil engineering. Speed limits in Chattanooga/Hamilton County are more often set by management based on resident complaints than an engineering study.

Notwithstanding voodoo engineering, the regulations are the regulations and the speed limit is what is posted. Failure to obey risks a citation. Buy the best Electronic Counter Measures you can find.

A safe speed is in the pucker of the beholder. I counsel conservative energy management and 1 or 2 escape routes.

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John
'16 R-Pod 180


Posted By: offgrid
Date Posted: 11 Apr 2020 at 8:12am
Originally posted by lostagain

The 80 limit on I-80 is new, but copies UT, 80 all the way from just west of Salt Lake to the NV state line.  Personally, I find driving that fast very uncomfortable in a Mazda cx5.  There is no way I'm driving that speed with a trailer.  I'll keep it around 60, but a 20 mph differential is just plain scary.  Far better to take US 50 to head east.  It's slower and much more interesting.  Great places to camp along the way.

My experience with the rules of the road in the original 13 colonies is that they have no sense of organization.  In NJ I had to look up some driving rules and found them mixed in with laws about utterly unrelated topics, such as a contract rule and murder laws, and there were all kinds of rules about horse drawn sleighs.  In the entire time I lived in NJ, I never saw a horse drawn sleigh on a road.  

The problem with taking secondary highways in places with lots of at grade intersections and driveways is that greatly increases the frequency of speed differentials as slow traffic enters and exits the roadway. That's not a problem in rural NV 'cause hardly anyone lives out there but it is in the rural east. The interstates are much safer, even if you're travelling at 65 rather than 50. 

We probablycan't use NJ as an example of a state with sensible laws. Its the only state where you can't pump your own gas. Somehow or other the rest of the country can get that done safely, but once inside the boundaries of NJ a motorist stupidity field engages and folks can't put gas in their tanks without killing themselves. Then there are all those jug handle turns...

OTOH, I don't think that the original 13 colonies have any monopoly on regulatory peculiarities. The 55 truck and towing limit in CA is one example. Another in your state is rather interesting. I gather that Elko never bothered to rescind a law dating from the 1918 flu epidemic requiring folks to wear masks at all times while on the streets. So perhaps eventually everything comes back into fashion, even masks in Elko and sleighs in NJ. LOL


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1994 Chinook Concourse
1995 RV6A Experimental Aircraft
2015 Rpod 179 - sold


Posted By: lostagain
Date Posted: 11 Apr 2020 at 11:39am
Oregon doesn't allow self service except at night in rural areas.  Currently, with the pandemic, the fire marshal has allowed a temporary lifting of the rule.  Some towns in the N.E. also prohibit self service.  I have to say, when I lived in NJ and it was cold and stormy, pulling into a gas station and being to say "fill'er up!" was pretty nice.  And the prices there were far lower than adjoining states, though they've since raised the taxes.

As for Elko, as with all towns and cities in NV, we are very forward looking and leaders of the civilized world.  Elko is an example.  The mask ordinance can now be implemented again without the need to hold a city council session, thus maintaining social distancing, which is pretty easy to do in rural NV.  The truly sad thing about social distancing and closure of non-essential businesses, not only is our sewing business completely shut down, a far older business is also shut down, depriving some rural counties of much needed tax revenue. Unhappy


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Never leave footprints behind.
Fred & Maria Kearney
Sonoma 167RB
Our Pod 172
2019 Ford F-150 4x4 2.7 EcoBoost


Posted By: offgrid
Date Posted: 11 Apr 2020 at 12:50pm
I stand corrected re OR. I had read that it had rescinded its gas pumping restriction but I see that it was only partial. Someone must have done a study that found rural night owls have a higher IQ than other Oregonians. 

I would think an attorney would not favor arbitrary decisions by law enforcement as to which statutes to enforce and which to ignore, as Elko would be doing without city council direction. So much for the even handed application of criminal justice. Tongue

I'm not touching the shutdown of the oldest profession in NV other than to say that it might be argued that it is an essential industry in this period of isolation and high stress. 



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1994 Chinook Concourse
1995 RV6A Experimental Aircraft
2015 Rpod 179 - sold


Posted By: lostagain
Date Posted: 11 Apr 2020 at 2:39pm
There are many statutes that are to be used only in unique or special circumstances.  Even lawyers and judges have the capacity, at least on occasion, to use common sense.  The same is true for most police, though some become a little confused at times.  

The foresightful town council of Elko used this common sense and now have the perfect enforcement mechanism for the publics's safety.  As I said, it is just one of many examples of our forward thinking in NV.

As for necessities, worker safety comes first, even if there is an increased perception of need due to isolation and high stress.   Adequate protection of the "independent contractors" would make the utilization of their services rather pointless.  What is terribly unfair, however, is that these hard working people are ineligible for unemployment benefits unlike those who work in cabarets providing only temptations.  A solution is being considered.


-------------
Never leave footprints behind.
Fred & Maria Kearney
Sonoma 167RB
Our Pod 172
2019 Ford F-150 4x4 2.7 EcoBoost



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