12v system not working, R-POD 180
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Forum Name: I need HELP!!!
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Printed Date: 15 May 2024 at 5:23pm
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Topic: 12v system not working, R-POD 180
Posted By: flgbanjo
Subject: 12v system not working, R-POD 180
Date Posted: 28 Apr 2021 at 8:20pm
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I've done some Googling and haven't figured this out yet. 2 6v batteries in series, they've been on trickle charge over the winter. Hooked up to my 180 and none of the 12v system works (lights, hitch lift, etc). If I plug in our vehicle via the hitch power hookup, everything works like a charm. If I plug into shore power, everything works great. Just not with the batteries. If I multimeter the batteries their combined voltage is 12.7, so they should be ok. If I check for voltage at the solar hookup on the side, it's 0. I know they talk about manual reset boxes under the frame that the 12v system goes through. Looking around I can't find manual resets (with the little black button). I see a gang of three little grey boxes underneath near the front with the red leads going through them, but none of them have reset buttons. I looked and felt around on them. Just for grins I stuck my multimeter on the various nuts of the little boxes and was getting voltage.
It seems to me there has to be a reset some place in line between the batteries and the main circuits. I checked the auto fuses and the circuit breaker and they're fine, since the shore power and vehicle power all work. I'm sure this is a simple problem and I just haven't figured it out yet. Do any 180 owners know where the manual breaker resets might be located, if indeed we have any?
Help! Thank you oh great community!
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Replies:
Posted By: StephenH
Date Posted: 28 Apr 2021 at 10:13pm
Is there a cut-off switch that is turned off? Is it possible the batteries were connected in reverse polarity? That would blow the two 40A fuses toward the center of the power panel. Ensure the batteries are connected with the correct polarity and check the two fuses.
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StephenH
Happy is the man that findeth wisdom,...
http://www.rpod-owners.com/forum_posts.asp?TID=7712 - ouR escaPOD mods
Former RPod 179
Current Cherokee Grey Wolf 24 JS
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Posted By: flgbanjo
Date Posted: 28 Apr 2021 at 10:24pm
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Thanks for the reply! Cut off switch is turned on. Batteries are connected correctly, negative on first connected to positive on second, black lead to second battery negative and positive lead to first battery positive. I checked the two 40A fuses in the panel and they looked fine. If the fuses had blown, wouldn't nothing get power from the car connection at the hitch? My confusion is that I get 12v power from the car hitch connection and from the shore power (from the converter I assume) so the fuse bays would be good. I reset all the circuit breakers in the panel just to be sure, and made sure the gfi was set, but that's 110v not 12v.
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Posted By: jato
Date Posted: 29 Apr 2021 at 7:02am
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I had this happen once in the past many years ago with similar symptoms which you describe; turned out to be a loose battery connection. Check your battery posts, clean off any corrosion on both the terminal as well as the line that goes to your pod and tighten with a wrench, finger tight won't cut it.
Also, check all your 12v fuses by looking to see if any red lights are lit at your box that contains breakers (120 side) and fuses (12v side). If lit, replace, as they are toast.
Lastly, go to your converter box and make sure your connections from the 12v wires are snug and tight.
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God's pod
'11 model 177
'17 Ford F-150 4WD 3.5 Ecoboost
Jim and Diane by beautiful Torch Lake
"...and you will know the Truth and the Truth will set you free."
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Posted By: StephenH
Date Posted: 29 Apr 2021 at 9:21am
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On mine when I had the dual 6V batteries connected, I had Red to positive lead on first battery. Jumper negative on first battery to positive on second battery. White to negative on second battery. No issues with it. I agree that you should check your battery connections and make sure they are not corroded and are tight. I am assuming you did check the electrolyte level in the batteries and topped it off with distilled water as needed.
You say the 40A fuses look fine. Did you pull them out and test them with a meter? Also, it could be that you have a defective battery cut-off switch. Bypass that and connect directly and see if that makes a difference.
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StephenH
Happy is the man that findeth wisdom,...
http://www.rpod-owners.com/forum_posts.asp?TID=7712 - ouR escaPOD mods
Former RPod 179
Current Cherokee Grey Wolf 24 JS
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Posted By: flgbanjo
Date Posted: 29 Apr 2021 at 7:53pm
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Thanks to everyone's replies! Looks like it must have been one of the 40amp fuses (I guess?) I pulled them out today and checked them visually and with a meter and both were fine. I put them back in. I then on a lark went out and disconnected shore power and the vehicle wasn't connected, and low and behold all the lights work, hitch lift works, radio comes on, etc. Something not seated right or something I guess. Glad it wasn't expensive! Have a great travel season you all!
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Posted By: StephenH
Date Posted: 29 Apr 2021 at 9:45pm
Could have been a slightly corroded connection for the fuse. In any case, I am glad things are working. Keep in mind the cut-off switch. I have heard of them going bad, especially the ones with the removable key. If you look in my mods, you will see the type I got. It has been reliable with no issues. I can't say the same for some of the other types. I have heard of them going bad.
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StephenH
Happy is the man that findeth wisdom,...
http://www.rpod-owners.com/forum_posts.asp?TID=7712 - ouR escaPOD mods
Former RPod 179
Current Cherokee Grey Wolf 24 JS
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Posted By: TariS
Date Posted: 14 May 2021 at 9:58am
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Did you ever crack this problem? We have a 178 with battery drain issues I am struggling with.
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Posted By: flgbanjo
Date Posted: 14 May 2021 at 10:53am
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I fixed it by taking out the 40A fuses and putting them back in! I wish I could say I did something technical or stumbled across the magic fix, but it was as simple as that and I just assume it wasn't seated properly or was a little corroded or something.
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Posted By: jato
Date Posted: 14 May 2021 at 10:19pm
TariS. Please describe your battery drain issues. We are here to help.
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God's pod
'11 model 177
'17 Ford F-150 4WD 3.5 Ecoboost
Jim and Diane by beautiful Torch Lake
"...and you will know the Truth and the Truth will set you free."
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Posted By: TariS
Date Posted: 14 May 2021 at 11:10pm
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Our battery, only one 12 V, newly replaced, seems to drain very quickly, like in a few hours. Everything works on shore power, but even with the refrigerator using propane, we can't keep a charge overnight. The battery also seems to charge VERY slowly or not at all from the tow vehicle, which I have confirmed is delivering good voltage. I have been told another battery will help, but I am reluctant to install one before identifying existing problems (if they in fact exist). I replaced the power converter but that did not change things.
Are we asking too much from one 12V battery?
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Posted By: Tars Tarkas
Date Posted: 14 May 2021 at 11:34pm
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What do you run on 12v? The vent fan and the furnace fan run on 12v and they will run the battery down fairly quickly. The fridge will definitely run the battery down fast if run on 12v, There is never a good reason to run it on 12v though anyway. (All this is assuming 12v only -- shore power should keep your battery topped up through the converter.) Keeping the battery topped up from the TV is iffy, depending on your alternator output as well as the amps your wiring can deliver. You can have 14v with too few amps to do any good at all.
There are some small drains, like the CO detector, the brains of the fridge, lights on the radio, etc., that will run a battery down in a week or two (or more) but there's something wrong if you're battery is draining overnight unless you're running the furnace, or something like that, fairly intensely.
TT
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2010 176
FJ Cruiser
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Posted By: StephenH
Date Posted: 14 May 2021 at 11:37pm
There is also a large drain if the pin in the safety disconnect has been pulled. Check that to make sure the pin is fully inserted so the brakes are not fully energized.
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StephenH
Happy is the man that findeth wisdom,...
http://www.rpod-owners.com/forum_posts.asp?TID=7712 - ouR escaPOD mods
Former RPod 179
Current Cherokee Grey Wolf 24 JS
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Posted By: TariS
Date Posted: 15 May 2021 at 8:48am
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Tars Tarkas, Thanks so much for your quick reply. We leave Santa Fe tomorrow, traveling I 40 east. We won't be needing the furnace but traveling without the refrigerator working isn't fun. Can we travel with the frig running on propane? We turned the frig off and disconnected the radio and the RPod has kept 2/3 battery charge while sitting in the driveway for two days. Hoping for two things on our journey home: cold refrigerator and hot water. Thanks again.
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Posted By: TariS
Date Posted: 15 May 2021 at 8:50am
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Thanks StephenH, I'll check the safety pin this morning.
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Posted By: Tars Tarkas
Date Posted: 15 May 2021 at 9:56am
Originally posted by TariS
Tars Tarkas,Thanks so much for your quick reply. We leave Santa Fe tomorrow, traveling I 40 east. We won't be needing the furnace but traveling without the refrigerator working isn't fun. Can we travel with the frig running on propane? We turned the frig off and disconnected the radio and the RPod has kept 2/3 battery charge while sitting in the driveway for two days. Hoping for two things on our journey home: cold refrigerator and hot water. Thanks again. |
Some will disagree with this but yes, you certainly can run the fridge on propane while on the road. I do it all the time as do hundreds of thousands of other RVers. Some will say you have to turn the propane off when you go to a gas station. Not true. There are myths and there are truths about that. The myths are incorrect. There are some ferries and some tunnels where you do have to turn off the propane.
As for hot water, I leave it off when traveling. The water heater retains warmth for a long time and recovers quickly. It's only 6 gallons. If you can wait 10 or 15 minutes for a shower you'll be fine.
TT
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2010 176
FJ Cruiser
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Posted By: campman
Date Posted: 15 May 2021 at 10:38am
Hello TariS. I might be asking the wrong questions, but here goes...what type of battery did you install? If it is a 12 volt it should be a dedicated deep cycle, not a deep cycle/starting battery which are used in boats. It should especially not be a normal vehicle starting battery as they are designed for large electrical demands for a very short period of time (like starting your vehicle demands). I would also imagine that if it is indeed a deep cycle battery that it at a minimum would be a size 24, possibly a size 27...this just denotes the outside dimensions of the battery and deep cycle batteries are far heavier due to their thicker plates, which are needed to allow deeper discharging of the battery than start batteries.
It is a new battery, but was it allowed to discharge and freeze? This will damage/kill a battery as well. They won't hold a charge.
You can have your battery tested at a local automotive store, sometimes for free. This would determine if you have a faulty battery.
Do not add a 2nd battery to your system as batteries, if tied together should be of identical age, size, manufacturer, capacity etc. One good and one weak or bad battery will ruin the good battery in short order.
A suggestion would be that once you have remedied your situation and you don't have a battery cut off switch to stop any battery drain that you at least disconnect your battery for short periods of no trailer use. For longer periods bring the battery home and either keep a trickle charger on it or charge it every month or 2 to maintain it.
If it is a wet battery (where you can open the caps to check and add distilled water) you can do exactly that if you are comfortable with and know how to do it safely.
You may have a bad battery, and it should be under warranty as it is very new. If you take it to a shop to get it load tested, you might have to get a new one and return the bad one when you get home.
Hope this helps, and good luck!
Andy
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Andy and Laurie
'16 F150 5.0 4X4 w/factory tow pkg
'21 RP192
"If the women don't find you handsome...at least let them find you handy!"
Red-Green
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Posted By: TariS
Date Posted: 15 May 2021 at 9:12pm
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Thanks TT We never keep anything on really when traveling. We'll run on propane for now and hope for battery charge enough to have hot water. Thanks for your help and we'll keep you posted.... TS
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Posted By: TariS
Date Posted: 15 May 2021 at 9:15pm
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Campman, Wow, what a detailed reply. I'll pass this on to my husband who will understand more about your questions. Thanks a million TS
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Posted By: john in idaho
Date Posted: 16 May 2021 at 10:00am
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Heating water with a battery is not at all efficient with an rv. Most tow vehicles do not have a high enough output charging system for an rv battery.
RV refrigerators of the size in an rPod are not particularly efficient. Having the Refer on the shady side of the trailer helps as much as anything. Keeping things frozen can be rather iffy. We did find an ice cube maker at costco that uses minimal 110 v power and makes wonderful ice cubes --just not very faST. A 1000 w generator would power it easily.
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Posted By: Colt
Date Posted: 16 May 2021 at 10:51am
Originally posted by TariS
Did you ever crack this problem? We have a 178 with battery drain issues I am struggling with. |
There are several things that are 12V and always on, !ike the 'fridge controls, CO2 and Propane detector(s), thermostat, radio/c!ock, .... Mine will drain the battery in about 2 weeks without a power source. I have a 25 watt solar panel hooked to the battery, and it will just about keep the battery up with all it its base loads. Fifty watts probably would. So, I keep my battery disconnect switch off and the little panel hooked up when in storage.
How old is your battery? Their capacity Dec!ones with age and use, shortening the time to "dead".
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John
'16 R-Pod 180
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Posted By: flgbanjo
Date Posted: 19 May 2021 at 4:36pm
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Turns out my solution last time didn't work this time! Brought it back out of storage from two weeks ago, once again, no 12v unless I plug it into the tow vehicle or the house. Unplugged and re-plugged the fuses back in and no luck this time. I'll keep troubleshooting. If I find out what fixes this, I'll let you all know!
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Posted By: campman
Date Posted: 19 May 2021 at 4:55pm
Dang! I was hoping you had it taken care of. Thanks for getting back to us, I know I will be watching and hoping it is something as simple as loose battery post connections...they are tight, right? Maybe smear a bit of dielectric grease on the connections to hold the corrosion off..not the answer for you but a good idea anyways.
Hmm, are you sure your battery is good? Load tested at a shop to confirm serviceability?
When I was working on military aircraft I was taught to divide the system having an issue in halves (if the answer isn't apparent), test and continue halving the system to steadily reduce the size of the problem.
Everything working from TV and shore power eliminates much more than a half! Working through it in my head...if it isn't your heavy duty, deep cycle battery, all that is left is aft (errr, I mean behind) your battery and at or forward of your fuses/breakers...may be some loose connections at the breakers or are there connections between that need tightening?
Good luck!
Andy
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Andy and Laurie
'16 F150 5.0 4X4 w/factory tow pkg
'21 RP192
"If the women don't find you handsome...at least let them find you handy!"
Red-Green
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Posted By: campman
Date Posted: 19 May 2021 at 5:02pm
Okay, I read your write up again...did you disconnect your battery while it was parked for 2 weeks? If no, that would drain your battery as others here have already mentioned. This will damage your battery for sure. Did you use the battery disconnect if so equipped? If you have a battery disconnect, that could be the problem area. Check for power on both sides to see if it has failed. I think another contributor (Stephenh) mentioned they can fail.
That is all I can think of for now, have a good one.
Andy
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Andy and Laurie
'16 F150 5.0 4X4 w/factory tow pkg
'21 RP192
"If the women don't find you handsome...at least let them find you handy!"
Red-Green
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Posted By: flgbanjo
Date Posted: 19 May 2021 at 5:35pm
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Thanks everyone! Yes, I have a battery disconnect switch wired in and can confirm it worked last time. Turn off, 12v off. Turn on, it worked fine. Put it away for two weeks with the switch off, when to bring it out today and no power. I'll double check the post connections (good idea to check those!) but last time they were pretty solid. I had tested with a voltmeter at the junctions under the trailer past the 12v cut off switch last time and had power. I'll keep looking! So frustrating! I run through things again.
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Posted By: campman
Date Posted: 19 May 2021 at 6:37pm
Did you happen to test your battery before you hooked up shore power to see if your battery was dead after the two weeks of sitting. Load testing is different then voltage testing. Again, grasping at straws...wire connections where the 12 volt battery power comes into the electrical system at the fuse/cb box?
Andy
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Andy and Laurie
'16 F150 5.0 4X4 w/factory tow pkg
'21 RP192
"If the women don't find you handsome...at least let them find you handy!"
Red-Green
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Posted By: flgbanjo
Date Posted: 19 May 2021 at 7:24pm
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Haven’t load tested them. What’s interesting is if I test at the batteries I see 12.88v, but if I test at the solar plug in on the side which theoretically goes doorway to the batteries I get 0.38, so something is wrong. Having it plugged int to shore power for four hours and unplugging didn’t make a difference, no 12v power after unplugging shore.
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Posted By: campman
Date Posted: 19 May 2021 at 8:07pm
You metered the solar plug in the outside wall where you would plug in a solar panel...I would think that you shouldn't get an electrical reading there...I believe there would be a diode (amongst other electrical controls) in the line to the battery at a minimum to prevent the batteries from reversing the flow and feeding power to the solar panel.
It makes sense there is no power indication at the solar plug if I did understand you correctly.
12.88 volts is what I would consider a fully charged battery, which is 12.9 volts...Again, this only indicates volts, and is not a load test. We can't load test it by using electrical items on your trailer right now.
Question, is there 12v from the battery reaching your circuit breaker/fuse box.
The search for where the 12 volt electricity from the battery is being interrupted continues.
Maybe you have a bad ground issue where your battery is grounded? A bad battery ground might cause this? Throwing darts on this thought, sorry.
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Andy and Laurie
'16 F150 5.0 4X4 w/factory tow pkg
'21 RP192
"If the women don't find you handsome...at least let them find you handy!"
Red-Green
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Posted By: offgrid
Date Posted: 20 May 2021 at 6:50am
There isn't a diode in the line to the solar port from the battery, and you don't need one. Those wires run straight to the batteru. The solar charge controller will take care of any potential reverse current flow at night. So something is wrong on that line too. If you're not using solar just leave those two wires disconnected at the battery for now while you focus on getting 12v back operating the trailer.
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1994 Chinook Concourse
1995 RV6A Experimental Aircraft
2015 Rpod 179 - sold
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Posted By: flgbanjo
Date Posted: 20 May 2021 at 10:29am
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That’s one of the reasons I’m so confused, the solar port lines go direct so I should get voltage on the port. I have in the past just fine. Working on it today!
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Posted By: campman
Date Posted: 20 May 2021 at 10:45am
I am still thinking you may have a good (not) ground situation going on, that would be right at or close to the battery itself. With a bad ground nothing works right.
Watching and pulling for your successful conclusion to this, and still thinking about alternate causes. Keep us updated with your findings.
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Andy and Laurie
'16 F150 5.0 4X4 w/factory tow pkg
'21 RP192
"If the women don't find you handsome...at least let them find you handy!"
Red-Green
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Posted By: campman
Date Posted: 20 May 2021 at 10:54am
Reread OG's post and suggest going a bit further than just disconnecting the solar charge wires. I suggest disconnecting all wires from your battery. Test the battery, only SECURELY reconnect the wires leading to your power distribution panel. Test your system...you get the idea. Simplify the system you are troubleshooting.
Andy
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Andy and Laurie
'16 F150 5.0 4X4 w/factory tow pkg
'21 RP192
"If the women don't find you handsome...at least let them find you handy!"
Red-Green
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Posted By: flgbanjo
Date Posted: 20 May 2021 at 12:56pm
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SOLVED! Thank you everyone for your comments, questions, and support! Turns out it was a flakey shut off switch at the battery I had installed. It tested ok for continuity a couple of days ago so I eliminated it as a potential issue. Turns out that was a bad idea. Tested again today and no continuity. So I bypassed the cut off and went direct to the battery and voila! And yes, I should have done that at the beginning! So, lesson learned, always go to the battery first and then backtrack from there. Packing the trailer up for a long weekend of camping! This forum rocks and you people are phenomenal!
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Posted By: offgrid
Date Posted: 20 May 2021 at 2:00pm
Glad you got it fixed for your trip!
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1994 Chinook Concourse
1995 RV6A Experimental Aircraft
2015 Rpod 179 - sold
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Posted By: campman
Date Posted: 20 May 2021 at 2:38pm
Way to go flgbanjo, so glad that you found it and you are good to go for the weekend!
Andy
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Andy and Laurie
'16 F150 5.0 4X4 w/factory tow pkg
'21 RP192
"If the women don't find you handsome...at least let them find you handy!"
Red-Green
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Posted By: JR
Date Posted: 20 May 2021 at 3:54pm
It really gives you a sense of accomplishment when things go right. Have fun on your trip because you earned it.
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Jay
179/2019
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