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Solar generators

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URL: http://www.rpod-owners.com/forum_posts.asp?TID=15143
Printed Date: 28 Apr 2024 at 11:20am
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Topic: Solar generators
Posted By: gpokluda
Subject: Solar generators
Date Posted: 12 Feb 2022 at 4:12pm
Greetings Rpodians
We are thinking about taking the plunge into the world of solar and wonder if anyone out there has any experience with solar generators. We want to be able to use the generator for other activities, so we don't want to invest too much in to solar technology that is hardwired into our 2017 r179.

Our thought was to get something like a Jackery 1500 solar generator with 4 solar panels and simply plug the rPod into the solar generator just like we would if we were connecting to our Champion 2000 inverter generator. We know we can only run certain items which, given our 5 years of rpodding, is plenty for us. 

Has anyone had any experience with solar generators or the way in which we plan on using it? Any recommendations?

Thanks
gpokluda
2017 r179
2016 Nissan Frontier SV



Replies:
Posted By: mjlrpod
Date Posted: 12 Feb 2022 at 4:31pm
Just for clarification, when I hear the term "solar generator" I think of course, of a generator. In reality, are these basically self charging batteries?  Just a normal 12 volt battery, that also has maybe a small inverter or converter, that allows very small electric appliances to run, but recharges itself with a solar suitcase or panel? So it's not at all a generator in the sense of the word. I'm not looking for the " well technically it could be called a generator because....." 

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2017.5 Rp-172
2020 R-pod 195
2015 Frontier sv 4.0L 6cyl
I'll be rpodding


Posted By: gpokluda
Date Posted: 12 Feb 2022 at 5:28pm
Your description is correct. They are indeed called solar generators and will power the small appliances you mention plus refrigerators and microwave ovens if the wattage is adequate. Thanks!


Posted By: offgrid
Date Posted: 12 Feb 2022 at 8:06pm
They are packeges consisting of sall solar modules connected via a charge controller to a battery. Both the solar modules and battery are DC devices. The battery in turn runs and inverter which produces ac output from the dc battery input. So, not a generator at all.

The problem with using one of these packages in lieu of an actual generator is that they produce very limited energy output. Energy is power x time so one might have a 1500 watt power capacity but can only produce this for a few minutes before the battery is discharged. in comparison a generator will run as long as you have fuel to power it.

The other issue is that it would be terribly inefficient as most of the load devices in the trailer are 12Vdc and are charged by the onboard converter.So you would be taking DC output from your solar modules, using it to charge a battery, then converting that to ac to feed to the trailer, then converting it back to DC to charge the trailer battery, then finally to the end load device in the trailer.   You would lose at least half the energy you had available if you just charge the trailer battery directly from the solar modules.

You can get portable solar modules and a charge controller which can directly charge the trailer battery without having to be permanently mounted, so they can be used for other things. That is they way most folks do it and a much more efficient solution than one of those package systems.


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1994 Chinook Concourse
1995 RV6A Experimental Aircraft
2015 Rpod 179 - sold


Posted By: Tars Tarkas
Date Posted: 12 Feb 2022 at 9:28pm
All of the "solar generators" I've seen are just batteries with a built-on converter.  You already have that with your Pod battery and converter.  You can get the same results for a lot less -- and have less to lug around -- with something like a Renogy solar suitcase hooked up directly to your Pod battery.

Depending on where you're camping, you might also want/need a fossil fuel inverter generator.  Solar is great at the beach or in the desert, for example, where you have to camp in the sun.  If you ever want to camp under the trees, or you have 4 days of rain, a regular generator can come in real handy.  I have both solar and a gas generator and often only take only one depending on where I'm going.

TT


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2010 176
FJ Cruiser


Posted By: gpokluda
Date Posted: 13 Feb 2022 at 6:27pm
I know the Rpod already has a solar connector. So do I need to get a controller if I decide to the portable solar panel route and hook up to the solar port on the side? Thanks.

gpokluda
2016 Nissan Frontier SV
2017 Rpod 179


Posted By: StephenH
Date Posted: 13 Feb 2022 at 8:34pm
My understanding is that the newer RPods come pre-wired for solar, but they do not have a controller. The 2017 179 is probably like the 2016 179 that I have. The solar connector is on the side near the door. It is simply a plug and a wire leading to the battery tray. The wires come disconnected and they need to be properly connected so that the polarity of the plug will be correct. Then a solar panel can plug in using an SAE connector. However, one has to be aware of the polarity and make sure that the polarity matches between the battery and the controller. You might need a gender changer to reverse the connection polarity depending on how things are wired.

I got a Renogy 100 Watt panel. It came with a PWM controller. See this for information on the difference between PWM and MPPT controllers:

https://www.renogy.com/blog/what-is-the-difference-between-mppt-and-pwm-charge-controllers/ - https://www.renogy.com/blog/what-is-the-difference-between-mppt-and-pwm-charge-controllers/

I re-wired the output of the controller to use Andersen PowerPole connectors. I have a longer cable that plugs into that to run to either the SAE connector (with a jumper I made) or the 60A PowerPole connector I installed on the A frame. I also use that one to plug in a cable to run my ham radio transceiver when we are somewhere for sufficient time to allow me to set up my antenna. That lets me use the RPod's battery to run the radio instead of the truck's battery. I bought the kit for the solar MC4 connectors, but they are a pain to use when connections need to be plugged and unplugged frequently. They are great for stationary setups where the connections will be made and left alone. The Andersen PowerPole connectors are much more tolerant of repeated plugging/unplugging.

This is probably more information than you need right now, but just file it away for possible future use.

Hopefully, this will help.


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StephenH
Happy is the man that findeth wisdom,...

http://www.rpod-owners.com/forum_posts.asp?TID=7712 - ouR escaPOD mods
Former RPod 179
Current Cherokee Grey Wolf 24 JS


Posted By: offgrid
Date Posted: 14 Feb 2022 at 5:03am
The "solar ready" rpods just have wires pulled for a solar connection, no controller, no fuses.

There is no reason at all you have to use them. You can also connect directly to your trailer battery if that is more convenient. In my opinion for a portable system it is. Why suffer from voltage losses (which at 12V can be significant) just to get to the rear of the trailer from the front, if you're going to connect a portable kit anyway?

Either way you connect, starting from the battery, you need an inline fuse at the battery +12v terminal to protect the wire to your controller. Next comes the controller, then the solar module. You will have a +12V and a negative connection to make between each. That's all there is to the electrical connections, very simple.

I would suggest using a minimum of 12 gauge wire and wire run of at least 25 feet so you can move your portable solar module to a nearby sunny spot. A 15 amp fuse would be good back at the battery.

A 100 to 120 watt solar module works well for most people. Get a glass/aluminum frame module, not a so-called flexible module. Pretty much any brand will be fine, you do not need to pay extra for one of the RV name brands. Be sure it has the right voltage for 12V battery charging (max power voltage around 17-18V is what you're looking for).

You can attach some fold up aluminum back legs to the module so you can tilt it up, just a couple pieces of small aluminum angle bolted to the frame and allowed to rotate will work fine.

For controllers, a simple PWM type will work for a basic system. You can mount that to the battery box, inside a front storage area, or to the back of the solar module. Or both. Your choice. The controller should be rated for 15 to 20 amps.

The cable can be hardwired at the solar module end with a connector at the trailer end or vice versa. An inexpensive way to make up a nice flexible cable would be to buy a heavy duty 12 gauge extension cord and cut the connectors off at both ends Dont use the 120Vac connectors for 12V, that creates a safety hazard down the road when someone could inadvertently connect 120V there. The Anderson connectors StephenH suggests are a good choice.









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1994 Chinook Concourse
1995 RV6A Experimental Aircraft
2015 Rpod 179 - sold


Posted By: Linda&Gino
Date Posted: 14 Feb 2022 at 1:59pm
Thanks for the reply. That is most helpful. For this go around I am going to order a 100watt suitcase solar panel kit and controller. Appreciate the help.


gpokluda
2017 Rpod 179
2016 Nissan Frontier


Posted By: offgrid
Date Posted: 14 Feb 2022 at 5:06pm
That's just fine. But it should still get a fuse at the battery end. The "solar ready" connector on the rpod doesn't provide one, so if the kit you get doesn't provide one either you can just get an inline fuse holder from NAPA or online and a 15A fuse and add it.   

-------------
1994 Chinook Concourse
1995 RV6A Experimental Aircraft
2015 Rpod 179 - sold


Posted By: gpokluda
Date Posted: 13 Mar 2022 at 8:51am
Wanted to give you all an update on what I decided. Thanks for all of the information and advice! I decided to forgo the Jackery solar generator and add a portable solar panel kit to the mix. I skipped the solar port on the backend of the R179 and set up a quick disconnect at the battery bank (two batteries and yes, I have an inline fuse Smile). I also installed a Renogy 1000 watt pure sine inverter along with a fuse and battery disconnect in the storage compartment at the front of the R179. I added two outlets with USBs in the trailer, one by the bed along with the inverter's remote control and one in the kitchen. Everything seems to work as planned. Batteries charged up fine in the weak February sun in New Mexico. The 1000 watt inverter runs our small, 4 cup coffee pot and charges our electrical devices which is all we wanted to do in the first place. Taking it all out in a couple weeks camping in the Southern desert in New Mexico but still taking the generator just in case. Big smile

Gino
2017 R179
2016 Frontier SV


Posted By: offgrid
Date Posted: 13 Mar 2022 at 11:59am
Sounds like you have it covered!

-------------
1994 Chinook Concourse
1995 RV6A Experimental Aircraft
2015 Rpod 179 - sold


Posted By: StephenH
Date Posted: 13 Mar 2022 at 7:20pm
Good. I am glad you found a workable solution. I look forward to reading how it works out during your upcoming trip.

-------------
StephenH
Happy is the man that findeth wisdom,...

http://www.rpod-owners.com/forum_posts.asp?TID=7712 - ouR escaPOD mods
Former RPod 179
Current Cherokee Grey Wolf 24 JS


Posted By: LongRanger
Date Posted: 20 Oct 2022 at 9:02pm
Originally posted by gpokluda

Wanted to give you all an update on what I decided. Thanks for all of the information and advice! I decided to forgo the Jackery solar generator and add a portable solar panel kit to the mix. I skipped the solar port on the backend of the R179 and set up a quick disconnect at the battery bank (two batteries and yes, I have an inline fuse Smile). I also installed a Renogy 1000 watt pure sine inverter along with a fuse and battery disconnect in the storage compartment at the front of the R179. I added two outlets with USBs in the trailer, one by the bed along with the inverter's remote control and one in the kitchen. Everything seems to work as planned. Batteries charged up fine in the weak February sun in New Mexico. The 1000 watt inverter runs our small, 4 cup coffee pot and charges our electrical devices which is all we wanted to do in the first place. Taking it all out in a couple weeks camping in the Southern desert in New Mexico but still taking the generator just in case. Big smile

Gino
2017 R179
2016 Frontier SV
Curious how your trip with the new solar setup went?


Posted By: gpokluda
Date Posted: 23 Oct 2022 at 4:12pm
Hi Lone Ranger
I was just going to post some musings as we finished up a round of campground and dispersed camping in Northern New Mexico before winter arrives in the mountains. It has been about 8 months since we outfitted the 179 with an 1000W inverter, new group 24 DC batteries (2) and a GoPower 130 portable solar kit. My goal was to be able run our small coffee maker and charge phones and other devices without having to lug the generator around.

So far after roughly 7K miles of traveling including a loop up around the Pacific Northwest and back, I have to say that the setup met expectations. However, unless I get more battery capacity and more solar panels, my generator will always be in the back of my truck. While I have no statistics to measure, my gut tells me that the solar setup probably provided less than 10% of the power used while the generator supplied the rest. A lot of this is due to where we camp in the summer months, forested mountains where our panels rarely had access to direct sunlight and usually only supplied 5-7amps to the cause. So, in addition to having a generator (which weights about 35lbs), I also had 30+lbs of solar panel in the truck. No matter how you look at it, the value proposition isn't there. 

Where the panels do come in handy is when the 179 is in storage. I no longer have to remove the batteries as I just set up the panels and have the sun keep them topped for me.

We will now switch to our winter camping mode and head south to the deserts until April. With fewer trees and more access to clear sky, I hope the panels perform better but with a lower sun angle, I'm not holding my breath. All in all it was a fun experiment but I am not completely sold on solar and RVs yet.

FWIW, I originally was looking at Jackery solar generators. While they may not have met my use case, we sure have seen a lot of them this summer and fall. 


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Gpokluda
2017 Rpod 179(sold 2023)
2022 Escape 5.0TA
2022 Ford F150 4X4 3.5EB
Triumph T120


Posted By: LongRanger
Date Posted: 23 Oct 2022 at 4:59pm
Originally posted by gpokluda

No matter how you look at it, the value proposition isn't there. 



Thanks. That answers a lot of my questions. I've been iffy on trying the solar. Think I'll stay with the tried and true for now.


Posted By: offgrid
Date Posted: 24 Oct 2022 at 4:09am
7 amps is all you should ever expect to get from a 110 watt solar module. Solar modules are tested and rated full sun conditions at room temperature. As soon as you take them outside and put them in the sun they heat up. Power output goes down about 0.5% per degree C temp rise, and under full sun the module temp will rise by around 25-30 deg C. So out of the gate you will lose around 15%, more on a hot day of course. So at a normal charge voltage of around 14 volts you might get 110x85%/14= 6.7 amps. And that's under perfect conditions, no shade of any kind,  perfectly clear sky, module pointed directly at the sun.
 No one should be surprised if they rarely see more that 5 or 6 amps out if a 100 watt solar module. 

That being said, I disagree with the suggesting that solar might not be tried and true. It is far more reliable than any other power source you could own. There's really nothing to go wrong, you just have to understand want it does and doesn't do. Set up your solar module facing south in a shade free location at a tilt angle of around your latitude minus 15 degrees  pretty much anywhere in North America in the summer months and you'll get on average at least 4 hours of equivalent full sun. So that's around 25-30 amp hours per day into your battery. That's enough for most folks boondocking if they're careful in their electricity use and don't expect to run air conditioners or microwaves or coffee pots or other heavy load ac appliances. 

If you get a string of rainy days, you'll either need a generator or a large enough battery to get you through the cloudy period. How big? Around 4 days autonomy. So if you're using 25 amp hours a day you'll need around 100 amp hours available capacity, or around 200 amp hours rated capacity if using lead acid, maybe 120-130 ah if using lithium. You should still set up you solar though, even on a cloudy day you can get 1 or 2 sun hours, so that's 6-14 amp hours, which could up to double your boondock time.   

Camping under trees with no sunny spot for your module?  Bring that generator or enough battery capacity to last you through your boondock period. 

 


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1994 Chinook Concourse
1995 RV6A Experimental Aircraft
2015 Rpod 179 - sold


Posted By: mjlrpod
Date Posted: 30 Oct 2022 at 3:27pm
My Jackery can run my coffee maker effortlessly. I use it mostly for coffee, and T.V. at night. It works great and 200 watts of solar panel, I can top off the jackery fairly easily. I too will be hauling my Generator around for a while till I figure out exactly how to make everything work the way I want. Luckily, I already had the genny's so no biggie. 



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2017.5 Rp-172
2020 R-pod 195
2015 Frontier sv 4.0L 6cyl
I'll be rpodding


Posted By: gpokluda
Date Posted: 30 Oct 2022 at 5:09pm
@mjlrpod, what size Jackery did you get. I was looking at the 1500 when I started this experiment. How are the solar panels holding up. A couple of folks that I had talked to who had Jackerys said that it doesn't take a lot of wind to start moving them around.

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Gpokluda
2017 Rpod 179(sold 2023)
2022 Escape 5.0TA
2022 Ford F150 4X4 3.5EB
Triumph T120


Posted By: mjlrpod
Date Posted: 30 Oct 2022 at 5:37pm
Originally posted by gpokluda

@mjlrpod, what size Jackery did you get. I was looking at the 1500 when I started this experiment. How are the solar panels holding up. A couple of folks that I had talked to who had Jackerys said that it doesn't take a lot of wind to start moving them around.

I have the 1000 explorer. I felt the 500 extra that the 1500 put out wasn't worth the cost. Your mileage may vary. The panels are pretty light, but so far I havent had any issue. Granted I've only charged it up a few times so far, I got it about a month ago, and camping season is close to done. I will still use it this winter I think. As a back up system at a minimum. 



-------------
2017.5 Rp-172
2020 R-pod 195
2015 Frontier sv 4.0L 6cyl
I'll be rpodding


Posted By: john in idaho
Date Posted: 31 Oct 2022 at 10:38am
I hav e a suitcase solar panel either 100 or 150 - I would have to go to the barn to check.  But I have not found a way to secure it from a snatch and grab thief, which sort of limits its usefulness.  It will keep the batteries topped up in the winter here at home.


Posted By: Tars Tarkas
Date Posted: 31 Oct 2022 at 6:59pm
Originally posted by john in idaho

I hav e a suitcase solar panel either 100 or 150 - I would have to go to the barn to check.  But I have not found a way to secure it from a snatch and grab thief, which sort of limits its usefulness.

Maybe I'm living in a time warp but I have never had anything stolen from a campsite.  Knock on wood.  I try not to leave overly tempting items out unlocked, and I may have run a cheap bike cable through the "suitcase" of my solar suitcase.  It would be pathetically easy to overcome that, and I haven't always done it  I know what you're saying though.

TT


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2010 176
FJ Cruiser



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